The Closing Institute - Peer Mentorship Call

January, 2024

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Bart: Hello. What’s up guys? What’s going on? Look at all these faces. Voices on mute. How’s everybody doing? You guys closing some arches or what?

Jody: There we are. How are you?

Bart: You guys closing some arches or what? What’s up? Y’all closing some arches? You getting them going or what?

Jody: Soon.

Bart: Yeah? All right. All right. I’ve got a lot of people off to a crazy start, right? First of the year. I mean, just selling arches left and right. It’s been a really good start to the year for a lot of people. It’s exciting. You kinda get that lull between like Christmas and New Year’s. It kinda like you get that little- that little downtime where it’s quiet and then January it like ramps up. I’m just giving everybody a second to, uh, log in. Anybody have any good ones? Anybody have any good consoles to share or screwed-up ones? Anything that will entertain me while I’m letting everybody log on?

Jody: Just finished my lessons actually,

Bart: You did?

Jody: Day three today.

Bart: Oh yeah.

Jody: But yeah.

Bart: So you’ve just been looking at me.

Jody: That’s it. Just all for three days straight. I think well now.

Bart: Awesome. Awesome.

Lisa: Rebecca said the same.

Bart: Oh, yeah?

Lisa: She’s [inaudible] in front of her.

Bart: What’s up Rebecca? Cool. Cool. There’s something on there. I dunno what that is. Sorry. I’m not allowed to touch buttons here anymore. So I literally have like two people around me at all times for all of the button pushing and scrolling and changing of the screens. I’m… They took all privileges away from me, um, and that’s how- that’s how we roll now. So I… Oh, can you click that? All right, cool. We’ve got a bunch of people on the call. We’ve got a bunch of new people on the call as well. Um, have, uh, have you guys been… Anybody that’s new, have you guys used the 10, 10, 10 yet? For my new people, anyone done it for the first time?

Jody: Have not.

Bart: What are you waiting for?

Jody: Getting into the office. I’m working from home.

Bart: Oh, you are? Well, that- that, yeah. That has something to do with it.

Casey: I’ve been able to do it and I submitted my very first video to- to Morgan, which was a little embarrassing, but I did it anyway.

Bart: Hey, do not be embarrassed by that. I love it. I love it.

Casey: It’s hard when everybody’s watching.

Bart: Very first video you sent in? Hey, you’re gonna learn a lot just from watching it.

Casey: Yeah.

Bart: You will definitely, definitely learn a lot. So that’s…

Casey: I hope so.

Bart: That’s how you get better. Well, think about it like this, you know? It’s not… It’s just a situation where you have to send in a video. You’re not here when I watch it. You know what I’m saying?

Casey: Yeah.

Bart: In normal, like the way that I always learn, you’ve got somebody sitting right there with you in the consultation. Right?

Casey: I struggle with that.

Bart: Like a sales trainer or a boss or something like that. So at least we don’t have that.

Casey: Yeah. True.

Bart: Cool. So, hey guys, one thing I want to go through today, I wanna spend a little time because it was kind of, uh, uh, I’ve gotten a couple of different questions about it, uh, becoming an issue. And um, one is, how do we cut down on any refunds or buyer’s remorse issues that we may have? Uh, and number two is to talk about some, uh, some different techniques with follow-up, right? When do we need to follow up? What’s the best way to follow up? And just get some, uh, just get some color around those two things. Has anybody had recently somebody that came in, you sold them an arch, you thought it’s all done, and then like one week later they called back and they’re like, “Hey, uh, I can’t end up doing it. I need a refund or whatever.” Has anyone run into that? So all the questions were from people that do not get on these calls. If you haven’t run into it, you’re gonna run into it. You got…

Ashley Pavero: I’m sorry.

Bart: Yep.

Ashley: I didn’t hear the question. I was just jumping in coz I was actually getting out of a console. Um, what were you bringing up?

Bart: Uh, if anyone’s ever run into any issues of buyer’s remorse or patients paying for the treatment, scheduling and then act- actually asking for a refund before you’re able to do the- the- the treatment.

Ashley: Yeah. We absolutely have. Yeah.

Bart: So where- where do you guys think that comes from?

Jody: Uncertainty.

Bart: Yeah.

Ashley: They don’t understand the value of the treatment.

Bart: Well, typically, I mean, you did get them to sign, you did get them to pay, right? So- but what generally happens, we get some with remorse, it means emotionally you guys had them in the right state. You were- you were in really good rapport with them, you created a lot of urgency, and it’s generally more of like an emotional purchase for them. They didn’t necessarily connect all the dots or line up all the dots. They did it in the moment. Uh, some people call it an impulse buy, right? But it’s much more of an emotional decision. And then when they get back, they start thinking of all these other things that they may not have asked or they say, well, maybe I’m kind of rushing this, or whatever the situation is. But it’s generally when the situ- when the, uh, purchase is made more from an emotional standpoint than it is from a logical, uh, and that’s, and a lot of people say all sales is emotion.

I agree it is. But there’s definitely a logical component that needs to and should exist within every sale. So it’s not just one thing. It’s- it’s a good balance of both. Uh, the emotion says, “Hey, I want to do this and I want to do this now.” [laugh] That’s the emotional side. The logical side says, yeah, and by the way, you need to do this for these reasons. And if you don’t do it, then this is what you’re gonna be looking at. Oh, and by the way, you should do it now because all of the dollars line up, you’re getting a really good deal, blah, blah, blah, blah. What are… The- the logic is just the justification for the purchase. So if the patients don’t leave with a really good solid justification for why they just did what they did, and not just from a- from a health perspective, but from a financial point of view, you want them to have that down pat. And I mean, they can recite it better than you can, right? Um, you see people…

Ashley: Absolutely. You see people all the time when they go in, they buy something, they think they got a really good deal on it. They come and they tell you about what they bought and what’s the first thing they tell you about? The deal.

Ashley: The next [inaudible] they’re gonna pay or the deal. Yeah.

Bart: They could literally sell it better than salesperson. Oh geez. Well, I did this and they actually ended up giving me this and this and this. So you know what? I just figured I would just do the whole thing now coz it’s dumb to just spread it out or whatever. They have it down pat. That’s that- that logical justification that tells them it’s okay that they made a smart purchase. Does that make sense guys?

Ashley: Absolutely.

Bart: So that’s one thing that you want to make sure that you get them. When you got somebody, especially somebody that’s really eager, somebody that’s super emotional about it, they’ve got a ton of urgency, you still wanna make sure that we take the time we’re going through the bundle, you wanna make sure they know exactly how much below retail they’re buying, that they’re getting an unbelievable deal, why they’re getting an unbelievable deal, um, and, and make sure that that’s- that that’s crystal clear for them before they leave, okay? Um, that kind… That will help prevent it from happening in the first place. But you know what? Sometimes you can do everything perfect and, uh, and you can still run into it there. If- if you sell enough arches, you’re gonna run into buyers remorse. If you sell enough anything with large dollar amounts, you’re going to run into it sooner or later.

Um, this is… These are just about some ways to minimize it. Okay? So one way to minimize buyer’s remorse that I wanna talk about is just escalating their level of commitment. Um, and what I mean by escalating their level of commitment, yeah, they paid or you got them financed through proceed and you scheduled them, but in their mind, right? And this is the consumer mind, in their mind, if you haven’t done the work, they can get out of it. Makes sense? If you haven’t done the work they can get out of it. So when you close that patient, the- the most ideal thing to do is you do records on the same day. As soon as you’re done, we go in, we get records. The- the fastest you can do the smile design, the faster you can do it, the better. The faster you can schedule the surgery, the better. Point is we want to be in a situation where they signed and we have done work, we have spent time, which is the same thing as money, and we’ve started the process. Okay? If you sell them, we close them and we’re gonna do records in a week, you- you’re not really gonna have any leg to stand on or any logical way to push back if they come back in two days and ask for a refund. Does that make sense?

Ashley: Absolutely.

Bart: So start doing work as fast as possible. Okay?

Ashley: We- we also found… Uh, I’m sorry to intervene, but we also found to… We’ve- we’ve started to structure, um, our consults and we have a sheet for the patients to actually follow and bring home with what their next appointments are. We’ve seen a lot less via remorse[?] visits when we’ve now scheduled okay. You know, in four weeks time or three weeks time after we’ve done the record same day, we’re setting up a visit with hygiene to make sure we’re covering ourselves clinically with perio-charting and stuff. And then also setting up a visit with them to revisit with the surgeon before surgery. We’ve seen a lot less of that because they feel that they’re getting more value and more chair time. Not just, “Hey, okay, I’ll see you in six weeks, or I’ll see you in three weeks for your surgery.” They’re- they’re feeling like we’re actually caring for them more. Um, so we’ve seen a big decline in that. Um, and during that medical clearance process, because we’re setting deadlines for our doctors to be, have time to sit with the patient and go over their medical history and their findings and their blood work, which has been really great for us.

Bart: Awesome. And are they doing that at the same time as the smile design?

Ashley: So we’re- they are obviously referred out because they need to see their medical doctors and get blood work. But we’re making that… When they’re doing their smile design, we’re prepping their paperwork and setting those expectations for both them and the office. So it’s making a big difference because they’re looking forward to their next appointment and now they’re focused more on getting the medical stuff together than thinking about the price and doing background research and starting to search other offices or starting to look on YouTube at videos of the procedure and scaring themselves to death. They’re now focused and know that they have to get this stuff together in order to get the outcome that they want.

Bart: Yeah. You… And I mean, all that stuff is great. You just wanna make sure we- we don’t… I wouldn’t want to create necessarily a completely separate appointment for the doctors and the patients, but anytime you can get the doctors back in front of them for- I mean, even for a very short amount of time as you’ve seen, that’s gonna work really, really well. Um, and that kinda leads me into- to something else that you guys can do. I’ve got some practices to start doing this. This has made a huge, huge difference. So let’s say you got somebody in, you close them on a double arch, you start the records today, they leave, they go home. What’s been working really well, and this doesn’t take hardly any time, but it makes such a huge difference, is ideally it comes from the doctor that works really, really well.

The doctor doesn’t wanna do it, you can do it. But ideally, that afternoon or that- that evening, the doctor just shoots a quick text message to the patient, Hey, really enjoyed our time. I’m super excited that you’re moving forward on this or, I’m super excited that we’re starting this journey, um, I think you’re gonna have an unbelievable result already got started on the smile design. I’m- I’m so looking forward to- to our next appointment. Right? Something short, simple, sweet to the point. I like it to come from the doctor ’cause the doctors are in and out in 10 minutes. Does that make sense? And some of them do a better job connecting than others. And with the way that people are used to communicating now, they’re communicating more so through text messaging and email than they are through verbal communication, if you can, believe it or not.

So in a situation where we’ve got a doctor that’s been in there for 10 minutes, one thoughtful text message sent out after they pay that day, you guys wouldn’t believe how far that can go to put that patient at ease. And also, if the patient wasn’t in full rapport with the doctor after that text message, like, wow, this doctor took time out of his schedule. It’s- it’s 6:30 at night and he is thinking about me, or she’s thinking about me. It goes a long way. It’s something small, it’s something simple. Um, if the doctor doesn’t do it, if I was a treatment coordinator, I would do it, right? Because that’s just insurance. You’re just hedging- you’re- you’re hedging your bets here and you wanna make sure that the patient- that the patient feels like they’re special to you. And, um, and that’s something simple. You guys can even have the text messages for the most part. You can have them pre-made. So you don’t have to sit there and think about it. It doesn’t have to be anything big, but from the patient’s point of view, it comes off super thoughtful. Um, and that can be enough to just put their mind at ease that they’re in with the right people. Does that make sense?

Kung: How do you feel about the text coming and then being signed from the doctor and the pa- um, patient advocate or treatment coordinator?

Bart: You could do it, but it kind of screams computer automation.

Kug: Okay.

Bart: You know what I mean? You want it to come from a cell phone?

Kung: Well, it would, uh, because I- I’m getting a cell phone that I’ll use specifically for the leads. So it would definitely come from the cell phone that is set up for the- for the business.

Bart: Yeah. So it could… But I would put- I would put one name.

Kung: Do you think if I send it from that business text, but I signed his name, but I wrote it, that would be okay?

Bart: As long as it’s okay with the doctor.

Kung: Okay. I’m just trying to make it easy for him.

Bart: Yeah.

Kung: Okay. Thank you.

Bart: I think as long as it’s okay with the doctor and they know. Right? Because last thing you want is you send one and the next appointment…

Kung: And we agree what it was saying. Yeah.

Bart: Yeah. And the next appointment, the patient references it and the doctor’s like, well, what are you talking about?

Kung: Okay.

Ashley: Yeah. We all- we all do the same thing. So we have- we all have our cell phones that we use, um, to talk to the patients from day one. Um, you know, we’re- we’re doing our pre-war up call with the patients. We’re continuing that journey and connection throughout their whole journey. So even if after surgery’s done and they have a question, they have a direct contact and it really helps the patient to understand and feel like they have that connection with somebody in the office. Um, we found it helps a lot. Um, and after they do close, we always send them a little something, a card or, you know, a congratulations.

Kung: Basket.

Ashley: Basket or like a little fruit basket or flowers, something.

Bart: And you can keep doing all that stuff. All you guys, you can do all of that as well. You know? The- the more the better. It’s just like you’re just hedging, hedging. It’s like, okay, I made the sale, now let’s make sure that we keep the sale. Right? So we’re gonna go above and beyond do the things that the other- the other practices aren’t gonna do. So even if they were thinking about going somewhere else, after they get these things, we’re gonna create a feeling of reciprocity, the patients are gonna appreciate it, we’re gonna put their minds to ease. So anything that you guys can automate that will be sent out, that’s great. Um, I think what makes the text message so effective is because it comes off incredibly thoughtful. And it- it- it shouldn’t come off as automated. That’s the whole point. If it’s automated and it looks stock, you know…

Kung: Well, I would obviously try to choose some personal comment to make.

Bart: Yes.

Kung: Well, when we met or something. Yeah.

Bart: Well, and the fact that you’re doing it for the patient personally, that- that’s all you need to do. It’s just, I’ve had some practices put the same one together and just send the same one out with like the- the practice name. Yeah. And it feels kind of like an appointment reminder text message at that point. So as long as you guys do it, it’s gonna- it’s gonna carry the weight. It’ll- it’ll work really well.

Kung: Thank you.

Bart: No problem. Um, you guys, and then- and then aside from that, the other situation I’m sure everybody’s run into, right? You have a patient that comes in, we try to close them, we can’t close them, but they put a deposit down. You have a deposit, they put a deposit down. When they put a deposit down, are you guys scheduling them right when they put the deposit down?

Leslie: So I schedule a pre-op because that’s what we have to do in consent forms. So once they do the deposit, like, okay, we do this, we got you down for this. So they kind of know that they’re coming back for something.

Bart: Yeah. Oh, well, yeah. So if they put a deposit down, you definitely want them leaving with something scheduled for sure. Right? But the difference is they put a deposit down. If they couldn’t get financing, they’re working on their own thing, then you guys know, you know, the sale isn’t over and the follow-up is absolutely critical here. Because a deposit, they’re at a far greater risk of refund because they haven’t paid. You know what I mean? They put down five grand or they put down three- three grand on a credit card or whatever, 10%, 2,500 bucks. They did something like that. So those are your greatest risks for people that are going to want a refund.

Dr. Mark: So what do you suggest there, Bart?

Bart: If we take a deposit, then the sale’s not over. So anytime the sale’s not over, fine, we’re one step closer. I wanna make that patient think that the sale is over for all practical purposes. So I’m gonna go ahead and go through the motions and get everything scheduled. I’m gonna act as business as usual, but then I’m gonna get as much information on where that additional money is coming from and when. And then I’m gonna formulate a follow-up strategy from there to ensure that if something changes, you know, that- that I’m in the loop, but yet you want, with a deposit, you wanna make them feel like they’re a hundred percent committed, whether it’s a deposit or paid in full. You want that feeling, right? You wanna escalate their level of commitment either way. So I want them- I wanna make them feel like, hey, uh, we’re gonna go ahead, we’re gonna do the records, we’re gonna get started on the case today.

I wouldn’t change that just because it’s deposit. You get going, you schedule the smile design, you schedule the uh, uh, the surgery. I want them thinking everything is scheduled and we’re moving forward and you know, you’re gonna- you’re gonna assume the sale, right? And then the treatment coordinator, based on where that money’s coming from or what- what they’re saying, then you want to get some kind of a date for when that’s gonna be done. And you either schedule a quick call with them over the phone, right? Or it’s just a- a, um, you know, or it’s gonna be at the next appointment. You know, you just don’t wanna be in a situation where we schedule the next appointment in a week and then they don’t hear from us at all. We don’t hear from them at all. And then they just kind of miss the appointment, um, and then it’s like, oh God, now I gotta, now I have to track them down.

And sometimes when people miss appointments, then they start dodging you and then it just gets really tough to follow up. So if I had the next appointment scheduled in a week and they were gonna go to their bank, right? T get everything figured out before they leave, you’re asking them, okay, so when do you think you’re gonna go to the bank? Is this something you’re trying to get done this week, or you know, you have to make an appointment? Just kind of get some information out of them and say, yeah, you know, I’m probably gonna end up getting to the bank probably on Monday or Tuesday, something like that. Right? So Monday afternoon I’ve got it on my calendar. “Hey, text such and such.” And you go ahead and you text them and give them a touchpoint. I wouldn’t necessarily call them, um, but I would definitely text them, “Hey, how’d it go with the bank? Need any help on my end? Anything we can do, we’ve got you all set up for the smile design. Really looking forward to seeing you.” Boom. Done.

Dr. Mark: So that’s- that’s a little new first Bart with regards to the text and sending them something personal like that. Like, “Hey, how did it go at the bank?” Is it easier for them to just say, uh, I’m… You know what? It- it- it’s an easy cop-out. coz there’s no communication. You’re not hearing any tone in their voice to say, no, I didn’t get it, or no I’m not. And it’s an easy way for them to get outta it via text rather than a follow-up phone call is what I’m saying. So you’re saying do not call and text and then we usually call to get that sort of personal commitment. So I need your feedback on that.

Bart: The problem with the call is they usually don’t answer the phone. That’s the problem with the call. Right?

Dr. Mark: Well, we get permission from them or to get- to get that call. Like, can we- can I call you Tuesday? We get the commitment. Can I call you Tuesday after you go to the bank Monday or Tuesday?

Bart: Well that’s an appointment then. So you’re basically setting up an appointment. If you set up an appointment to call and they want you to call and- and they schedule the appointment with you, then call them. Um, but just for the most part, it’s so hard nowadays to get ahold of anybody with a phone call. If your number’s not programmed into their phone, the odds of them answering their phone, especially in election year, are like 0.00. Who the hell here answers a phone call that’s not programmed in.


Woman: That’s what we think.

Bart: You know what I mean? Especially in an election year, everybody’s gonna be getting spam six ways for Sunday. So my thing with follow-up is the first goal of follow-up is engagement. That’s the first goal. And it’s so much easier for someone to respond in the first place to text and there’s so much more likely to respond coz a lot of times, even if they know it’s you, if something’s going on, if they don’t… Like they can be in the middle of something and they can shoot you a text back, but to answer the phone and get into a- a phone call, they’re like, I don’t quite have time for this right this second. I’ll call them back. And it’s like, once they missed the phone call once if you guys call back again and they miss it again, now it’s a weird situation where they feel bad. You know what I mean? And then they almost- they almost push it off even further. So…

Dr. Mark: Makes sense.

Bart: I like text messaging. Hey, everything go okay at the bank. Need anything on- on our end? If so, let me know, if not, we’re ready for our appointment. How’s it going? That’s it. They’ll text you back something and then based on what that is, let’s say they text you back and they go, “Hey, I had a few problems at the bank. I’m trying to work it out. I’ll let you know.” Let’s say that’s the text. Say, okay, no problem. Hey, I got an idea for you got a second. I’ll call you from this number and then you call. Make sense?

Dr. Mark: Yeah.

Bart: So the- the text message is a way that I know they’re gonna see it. They can’t dodge it, they can’t just decline it and then there’s nothing they’re gonna see it. And if it’s casual enough, right? I’ll get some kind of response and that’s all I want when I’m following up coz the deposit, you’re not done yet. So I just wanna maintain engagement and I don’t really care if it’s good news or it’s bad news. What I don’t like is no news. No news is trouble.

Dr. Mark: No news is not good.

Bart: And- and I don’t know what to do about it. Right? So you stay in contact if it’s bad news, right? Okay, no problem. I got an idea in how I can help you with that. You got a second to talk, I’ll call you from this number and you don’t wait for a response. I’ll call you from this number. Boom, I’m calling. If they can’t talk, they’ll say, “Hey, can’t talk. I’m driving right now or whatever.” Okay, no problem. I’ll give you a ring in like 10 minutes, same number. That’s it. Boom, boom. But now I’m gonna get them on the phone. So I use text to ensure that they see what I need them to see.

Dr. Mark: I see.

Bart: Solicit engagement, but I don’t use it for full-blown dialogue. When I need a dialogue, I use text. “Hey, I’m gonna call you from this number.” And then I just call. And- and- and the success, the connect rate you’re gonna have if you text, then call versus just call. It’s- it’s gonna be probably 10 x as effective.

Bart: Guys, does that make sense?

Dr. Mark: Yeah.

Ashley: Absolutely.

Bart: Okay, cool. So that- that’s for a deposit, but that- that rule kind of holds water even with people that come in for a consultation and we didn’t get them closed, right? So what do you guys do? Who wants to let me know? What do you do if they come in for the consultation, they don’t have any direct objections, they didn’t have anything bad to say, they just said, “Hey, I need to speak with my wife about it, you know, we’re 90% in, I think this is what I want to do, um, you know, give me a couple of days to think about it and I’ll call you back”? All right. Let’s say they do that, right? What do you guys do for follow-up? Somebody, give me an example.

Ashley: We actually set another appointment up on a weekend or something that’s more, um, reasonable or within their schedule for them and their spouse to come to the office and sit down together. That way the spouse understands the value of the treatment and what’s really going on. Because what we find is that 90% of the spouses have no idea what’s going on in their spouse’s mouth. Um, and we also offer obviously a phone number for them to call in case their spouse has questions at, you know, eight o’clock at night, seven o’clock at night. We make ourselves accessible at that point. But we do set a direct time to meet with both of them.

Bart: Okay. Who else?

Woman: Usually we usually we just call them. I- I say to them, is it okay for me to follow up with you on Friday at two o’clock? They say, yes. And then… And I also always give my cell phone number if they have any questions or their husband doesn’t understand anything, they call me and I’ll explain it.

Dr. Mark: Yeah. We usually also as well, but lead into, if they say, I gotta talk to your wife and or- or whatever our objection is, you know, we always tell them- I flat out tell them if your husband isn’t here, they’re not gonna understand or your spouse isn’t here, your significant in here, whoever’s makes that financial is never gonna be able to get that- get a number of 50,000 and- and- and take that and stomach that very well. So we say you’re not gonna be able to translate that information the same way I will. So what we’d like to have you do is come back, what- and, uh, like what Ashley just said is come back for another appointment with the spouse at that point. Why don’t we do this? Let’s come back and why don’t you bring your spouse with you this time? And usually, we figured that out prior if they need to be there or not. We try to figure out if their spouse, if they’re the one who’s gonna make the financial decision or not. So we do that. We set an appointment and we also ask for their permission to get a phone- uh, when can we follow up with you and when’s a good time that we can chat again about the situation. So those are the two things that we do.

Bart: Okay. So you guys actually like believe these people then?

Dr. Mark: [laugh]

Bart: That’s the weird thing, right? I’m thinking, do you guys really… So you believe them?

Woman: Yeah.

Bart: Because- because you you have a very- a very logical way of handling it, but you’re- but all those ways suggest that you actually are buying this crap that they’re saying about the spouse when like… Alright, it- does it happen sometimes? Yeah, kind of. Yeah. But the vast majority of the time, you know what I mean? It- it’s not that they couldn’t say yes.

Woman: I disagree. I think a purchase…

Bart: They do it all that… How many times do you guys say yes, you buy something and then you tell your spouse why you bought it?

Dr. Mark: But not- but not 50 bar. Not 50,000, not 25,000.

Bart: Oh, I do that all the time. The more it’s, the less I tell her because then I’m already done with it. I just have to have a good story behind me. You know what I mean? I certainly… I’m a forgiveness not permission type of guy.

Kung: Yeah, lucky you.

Bart: So here’s the thing…

Ashley: Bart, we also in our warmup calls just to- to feed off of that in our warmup calls, we also make sure that as much as we don’t want it to be the topic of conversation, we do find a way to bring it up that it’s a good idea to bring your spouse or, you know, if this is, you know, this is an investment you’re making to bring your spouse along. So we- we often are moving the appointments before they even come into the office for the first time to meet with both them and their spouse. So we are doing that in the warmup to try to avoid those conversations and those awkward endings to a consult I should say.

Bart: Sure. Sure. But you’re gonna have them. You guys- you guys hear that, right? Let me talk to my spouse. Let me think about it. The question that you have to have somewhat of an answer to, to formulate any follow-up plan, any decent follow-up plan that will work, the question is, okay, what specifically do they need to talk to their spouse about? Because you don’t just need to just talk, right? Like there’s something there that they’re not sure about or they’re concerned, they want an extra opinion, or whatever the case may be. I guarantee you it’s not simply for permission. Does it happen sometimes? Yeah, but it’s the exception, not the rule. And that’s why all the follow-ups are no good here, right? The follow-ups are no good coz there’s nothing- you don’t know what the actual objection is. We don’t know. We just know they gotta talk to their spouse. So what are we supposed to do? So it’s really important that nobody leaves the office without buying. And you guys don’t know what the objection is. You have to know where they’re uncertain when they leave. If you know where they’re uncertain and you know what the objection is, now we can formulate a really good follow-up strategy that’s specific and it makes sense.

But if you don’t, what are you saying when you follow up? “Hey, how’d it go? Did you talk to him? Did you talk to her?” Like you don’t have anything to say there. It’s- it’s almost… It’s really difficult to even get them on the phone coz there’s no information- there’s no way to formulate a plan, right? So step 1, to a follow-up strategy is you have to uncover the objection right there. And that’s where that loop, the let me think about it loop, whether it’s a spouse or it’s- they just say, let me think about it. It’s the same thing, right? So you have to run that, you gotta run that loop to pinpoint exactly what the objection is, right?

Lisa: So hey Mark, Lisa- Lisa, we had two situations just recently where when they said, one of them said, I have to talk to my daughter, and the other one said, I have to talk to my daughters. Um, so I said to them, I said, absolutely. I said, why don’t we go ahead and FaceTime her and that way while we’re here in the chair, we can show her the CBCT and we can talk. And in those two situations, I was able to FaceTime the daughter. Um, we answered her questions without her having to come in and the patient closed on an upper and lower hybrid right then and there. In the second situation, we spoke to the daughters and the daughters wanted to know why we needed to extract all the teeth and they wanted to come in and talk to me. So I scheduled them immediately. I was like, I could see you tomorrow at this time. Come in and we’ll review the X-rays. And the two daughters came in and that patient’s doing a lower. So I just tried to like call their bluff sometimes. And I’m like, okay, so let’s go ahead and call them right now. Let’s see, let’s get them- let’s get them on the phone. And it’s worked a couple of times, so I’m gonna keep trying it. I’m gonna get nos, but when I get yeses, it’s been effective.

Bart: Okay, cool. And where do you go, your plan B if they’re like, oh, they’re at work or whatever. I can’t call them right now.

Lisa: So then in that situation, then we just follow up like others are doing. You know, we’ll call them back and I- I try to call them, you know, the next day I don’t let it get too cold. I’m afraid of week

Bart: Lisa, try this, try uncovering the objection. So you know, what about this, coz it’s not everything. There’s certain things they understand they don’t need to talk to anybody about, but they may be unsure or they’re- or they’re nervous about one aspect. Right? Uncover what it is and then say what you’re saying. Hey, well let’s go [inaudible]

Lisa: Is it okay to say that, to just say, so what do you think your wife or husband’s questions are gonna be?

Bart: Well, they’re probably not gonna want to answer coz they’re kind of being evasive anyways, right? So the way that you do it, that’s with that- that looping script. You know what I mean? We have to identify what the objection is in order to do that. It’s a- it’s a process of elimination. So what do you think are the reasons, where are the main points that somebody may be uncertain? Right? Number one, they might be uncertain about the treatment plan. They don’t get it. We’ve seen some calls, right? Where the recommendation part, it just wasn’t clear. I think there’s people that left, they don’t even know what the heck the doctor actually recommended sometimes. So one thing that could be holding them up and making them unsure is just the treatment plan itself. What is it? What all does it entail? All that, right?

Another one could be what the price. Is it a good price? Is it- is it high? Is it low? Should I do it? That’s a lot of money, blah, blah blah, blah. Right? And the third could just be like their connection with you or with the doctor, with the practice in general, right? Is it a good match? Those are the three areas, okay? That they might be uncertain. So what we’re trying to do with the loop is eliminate the most problematic one. So outta those three, which one do you think is the most problematic out of all of them by far?

Dr. Mark: Money. Money. Hands down. Money.

Bart: But if they don’t understand the treatment, why does the money matter?

Dr. Mark: Right.

Bart: [inaudible] even a thousand dollars for something they don’t understand, right?

Dr. Mark: Correct. Correct. But mostly what we found is that it’s money that- fitting it into their budget is what they’re most concerned about. Because these are large treatment plans.

Bart: Okay? And- and you’re probably… I would probably agree with you that that’s the most common, but I- but I don’t think that it’s the most problematic. I think if you have a patient that you made a- that you had a consultation with, we presented price. If they don’t- if they don’t even think that that plan make sense for them, the price doesn’t matter, nor does your relationship with them matter. They can’t move forward if that happens, right? If that’s the part they’re uncertain about, there’s no follow-up plan in the world that’s gonna work. You have to actually… That means it was a complete swing and a miss in the console. We have to eliminate that as a possibility. Okay? So when someone says something like, let me think about it or let me talk to my husband or wife, it’s always the same. So I say, yeah, that’s okay, no problem. I understand if you need to think about it. But hey, lemme just ask you a question here. When it comes to like, the treatment itself, right? Based on where you are now and where you want to be, just like- forget about everything else, like just the treatment itself. Does the treatment- does the treatment make sense to you? Like, do you love the plan that we put together? Is everything cool with the plan?

Do you guys see what I’m doing right there? I’ll tell you what kind of responses you’re going to get. But what I’m trying to say by- with my tone and how I’m gesturing is I’m trying to say, listen, forget about the money, forget about the time, forget about everything. Just logically like, does the plan make sense? I’m trying to remove all those things from their- from their head. I don’t want them to think about it. So I’m trying to isolate in on it. And you know what you’re gonna get. You’re gonna get some people that will say, “Oh yeah, no, I mean, plan makes perfect sense. Makes absolute perfect sense. I mean, this is- I definitely know this is what I need. This is what I want. I would love to do the whole thing right now. It’s just when I do it, I want to do the whole thing and I’m just not sure I can do the whole thing right now. So I’m just trying to like figure it out.” Okay, so what just happened? So what’s the objection there if you say something like that?

Dr. Mark: Money.

Bart: Yes, it’s money. It’s money. So guys with a follow-up and with the sale, the let me think about it. People and the, um, and the let me talk to my wife or my husband, people, they’re the same people and that makes up the majority of your follow-ups. So- but the follow-up is difficult and- and- and it’s not effective because we don’t have anything specific to follow up on, right? So the first thing is removing that from the equation. And most of the time when we remove it… Coz if they don’t understand the plan, you’re done. That ain’t getting sold. You have to start all the way over. That’s worst-case scenario. Worst-case scenario is they’re like, “Yeah, you know, I’m just- I’m just not sure that’s, you know, I’m just not sure that’s what’s gonna be best for me. I’m still thinking about, you know, possibly doing this or blah blah, blah.”

That means conceptually we never gained agreement. That means they- we never generated any emotion like we… The- the- the equation. Like it never happened. You know what I mean? They don’t see how it’s gonna take them from here to here. If that- if that’s the case, price means nothing and their relationship means nothing. So that’s… The first thing to eliminate is like, okay, it’s not the plan. Got it. So then it’s going to either be money or it’s going to be their connection with you, or it’s gonna be something different like some kind of a- some kind of a belief system or a phobia or something that they have inside that they have not- they haven’t spoken about, right? They could just be super, super freaked out about it. You know what I mean? It could be fear, it could be a couple of different things, but if you remove that from the equation, it’s gonna be very rare that they look at you and go, no, no, it’s not the plan. It gives you nothing else. Makes sense?

Dr. Mark: Yeah.

Bart: Okay, so we remove it. Now let’s say we remove it and we go, okay, they’re not sure about the price. So what they meant to say is, “Hey, I need to talk to my spouse about the price coz I’m not sure this is a good deal,” number one, or, “I’m not sure if we can afford it,” number two. What’s interesting about number two is that everybody knows how much money they have. Everybody. Nobody… You know if you got 50 grand or not, you know if you got 10 grand or not, you know if you can do it. So what they mean by, I don’t know if I can afford it, is what they’re doing is they’re thinking of all of the possible expenditures that they may have coming in the next 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 months, and they’re going, can I afford to do this now and still make the commitments? Does that make sense?

Dr. Mark: Mm-hmm.

Bart: That’s easy to handle. All these things are easy to handle if you know what the problem is. And the follow-up is super easy because we can continue the conversation and- and we can work with them to where they have something specific that they’re- that they’re looking for. Then the follow-up is kind of it- it almost becomes common sense. But that’s what I see with most of the follow-up, they’re not giving you guys an objection and we’re not pushing to find what the objection is. So the follow-up is super generic and- and it’s not- and it’s just not effective. And I get asked a lot of questions like, Bart, how many times should we follow up? How many times should we call? You know, I- I don’t know, maybe- maybe zero, right? I mean, you send a text message, get engagement, and then call or you call a bunch of times. It- it doesn’t really matter to me how many text messages send, how many times you call. Uh, ideally we send one text message, we get a response and we get them on the phone. But it’s gonna be really difficult to send a text message that’s not specific and actually get a response or get them on the phone. Do you know what I’m saying? So that’s where a lot of the follow-up kind of falls flat, right? If they… If you know specifically to go, “Hey, um, you know, I gotta figure out what my A1C is, you know, to make sure that I can move forward here. I’m gonna go… I’m gonna make a doctor’s appointment next week. I’m gonna get checked out, make sure everything’s good coz this is definitely what I want to do. Um, I’ll give you a call, I’m gonna try to make the appointment for Wednesday. I’ll give you guys a call back on Thursday. Do you see how easy the follow-up is for that? When you send a text message, you know what to say, you know what to follow up on. You’re following up on his appointment as far as A1C is concerned, but the more specific they are, the easier the follow-up. If they’re not specific or they’re evasive, the follow-up’s almost worthless. Make sense?

Dr. Mark: Right.

Bart: So if you have somebody that says, let me think about it, and you run the loop and they’re not participating at all and they won’t give you anything and they’re not open, they’re not honest, I don’t even follow up. It’s over. It’s over, right? You- you can follow up till the cows come home and they are not gonna pick up the phone coz they’re- they’re just not- they are not, um, representing like somebody that actually is looking for a way to do the treatment. They’re- they kind of are representing like somebody that just wants to get outta the office for one- one reason or another. Make sense?

Jody: Mm-hmm.

Bart: Okay. So let’s say it’s money, okay? And let’s say that, um, let’s say that the patient says, “Yeah, you know, it’s a lot of money. I just- I wouldn’t wanna spend $50,000 without at least running it by my husband or my wife,” right? Okay. I wouldn’t wanna do that. So I’m just going to, you know, give her the courtesy or what… I don’t even know what people say anymore, but you guys know what I’m saying? They say stuff like that, right?

Dr. Mark: All the time.

Bart: Okay. So let’s say that they say that, alright, what are we gonna do? What’s the first thing that you think of? Because I wanna see if you guys think, the first thing I think of when someone says that. When- when someone says that… If someone says that to me, the first thing I think of is I don’t ha- I didn’t do a very good job clearly showing them how good of a deal they’re getting. And I didn’t create any urgency around that. They don’t get it. You know what I mean? So if I hear that, I’ll say, okay, no problem. You’re gonna go home. So you’re just gonna run the price for them. Here, let me just go through this one more time coz I want to make sure that you know exactly what the deal is here and why I’m able to give it to you at this price. Okay? So let’s talk about full arches. Here’s what the average market value is for this boom, boom, boom. And I start going back to the logic because if any part of that story is true, which it doesn’t really matter, it wouldn’t change what I would do. But let’s say that it’s actually true, I want them going back to their spouse. I’m gonna give them the words and I’m gonna give them the pitch right now. I’m gonna give them an airtight pitch to go back and give to their spouse to where they understand it, they get it and they’re basically gonna go back and recite exactly what I’m telling them right now, assuming that it’s not all BS and this person really is sold, right? They really want the treatment and this isn’t actually a real thing, right? They’re not just using their spouse as a cop-out coz their spouse isn’t here, right? Coz sometimes they’re like, “Oh, I need to talk to my spouse about…” No, you don’t. You- you’re not sure about the price, but you are non-confrontational and you don’t wanna say that right now. Make sense?

Dr. Mark: Yeah.

Bart: So it’s not gonna change what I’m gonna do, but geez, it’s way better than, let me think about it or let me talk to them. There’s… You have nowhere to go with that. So you find out it’s price. They’re still not saying it’s too much. They’re saying, “Hey, I just need to- to speak with them.” Then you’re gonna go into the same thing. Go ahead and do a recap. Make sure they know exactly how much it costs, how much they’re gonna buy it for, how much under they’re getting, and go through that whole thing so they have it clear in their head. And as you’re going through it, you’re allowing them to interject at specific times. Because I’m trying to keep the dialogue going, to figure out if it’s them or if it’s really is the spouse. The more they talk, the- the better off you are. And, uh, and it- it’s not a big deal to handle an objection, right? Or to get into a negotiation. It’s just a problem when you don’t, you don’t know what it is. Does that make sense?

Woman: Mm-hmm.

Bart: Okay. So follow-up techniques. It’s always why did they not close in the first place. And your entire follow-up technique revolves around that. So let’s just say that it’s priced and you go out, what kind of text message would you send to that patient to re-engage them if they went- if they left because they think that, you know, they can get it cheaper somewhere or they say, “Hey, this is just my first stop. Honestly I love it, but I’m going to go to two or three more practices.” Most people won’t say that, but a lot of people think that and that is their plan. I’m gonna go to two or three more and then I’ll call you back. They just don’t say it. People don’t want to… Especially if you got a good relationship with them, they just don’t want any awkwardness. You know what I mean? So sometimes you can assume that happens. But if you know the objection and their main point of uncertainty is price, what’s your text message to follow up with this person and how long are you gonna give them before you follow up?

Dr. Mark: Now we ask- we ask permission. We ask permission how long would you need to find out, uh, what you need to get to? And then we would then sort of get it somewhat of a commitment from the patient [inaudible] you could follow up

Bart: Forgiveness. Ask for forgiveness. Forgiveness. No permission. I mean, you can say, “Hey, when can we follow, blah, blah, blah, blah.” It doesn’t really mean a whole lot in this scenario, you know what I mean? But when would you like to follow up? Let’s say you’re gonna follow up three days later. Okay? Let’s just say. All right, so you’re gonna follow up three days later. What are you gonna send them in text message? They don’t think your price is good. What are you gonna send them in text message to get them to talk to you again?

Casey: A hook. A hook. Tell them something. Don’t give them the details, but say something that gets them excited and they wanna call you back and figure out what it is.

Bart: Yep. Okay. Give me an example. That’s exactly [inaudible]

Casey: Hey, this is Casey calling from Highland Implant Center. I just talked to Dr. Leo and I’ve got some really exciting news for you. Give me a callback today.

Bart: Yeah, you already know the answer.

Casey: Really, but that’s what you would say, right? You don’t give them a hook, you just…

Bart: But- but- but- but I wouldn’t say it. I would text it.

Casey: Fair enough.

Ashley: Yeah, we- we do the same thing.

Bart: Go ahead.

Ashley: Sorry. We- we text them the same way. You know, we’ll ask them. We have some really great news from you, you know, looking forward to speaking with you. But we also include a before and after of a patient that we recently did things like that because that gets them excited as well because they’re seeing results. Something that they may not have seen before. And even though that brings the sale back, we also give them something to see from our office. And that imagery we’ve seen, they respond a lot quicker.

Bart: Well, depending on what their objection is. If their objection’s purely financial, I mean then they’re in, you know what I mean? They don’t need to see it before and after. They’ve already made up their mind they’re gonna do it. They’re just looking for a lower price, you know? So the thing with text message and follow-up guys, it has to be short, it has to be sweet and it has to have some type of mystery and you’ve got to play on the- on whatever it is that they’re looking for, right? So if you were gonna follow up text, you know, then, then you might say, Hey, um, I had a- a chance to follow up with Dr. Such and such, right? Or I was just speaking with Dr. Such and such about your case. We came out with a- with an idea. I think you’re gonna want to hear. I think we have a really good solution for this. Got a minute chat. I can give you a call from this number. You know what I mean?

Jeema: Question.

Bart: Tell them I have an idea. Yes ma’am.

Jeema: Alright, sorry. What is a good software for us to use to show the patient the before and after? Because we like the whole showing the patient the before, but we’ve got the InstaRisa, but that’s hard for us to show them the after right then and there. Is there like a good program that some other people are using that we can implement where we can just quickly print out and say, “Hey, this is how your afters gonna look”?

Bart: So are you not showing them before and after while they’re there?

Jeema: Correct. We’re not.

Bart: Why is that?

Jeema: We don’t have anything to show them after with. Like, what are we… I- we- we can… We show them PowerPoint slides as far as you know, hey these are cases we’ve done, these are their befores and these are their afters. But as far as the patient sitting right then and they’re in the chair being like, hey, this is you before, yeah, we can do that as a printout, but they’re after. I don’t have anything to show them.

Bart: You can use a DSD app or you can use- use preview. And look, it’s nothing that you’re gonna do and base your surgery off of it or case plan off of it, right? But it’s something where you can take it before, you can go on, you can do a quick design, and you can show them side by side digitally, the before and after while they’re in the consultation, which is, we usually use that during the second 10. You know? If you guys- you guys read through the script like in the second 10. The doctor says, “Hey, one of my favorite parts is that we’re gonna be doing is the smile design. That’s where we can customize everything, blah, blah blah. Actually, Jen already had a chance to get a headstart on this process and I wanna show you what she was working on coz you’re gonna look amazing. Check this out.” And then you show them the iPad, right, with the before and you slide it over, here’s the after and you can kind of slide it like this. And it’s not… It doesn’t have to be as meticulous as a case planning. It’s something like an assistant or someone at the front can do. But it gets the point across, which is you’re trying to plant that image in their head. So I would use that during the consultation.

Jeema: Okay. And what did you say that we can download? I’m gonna write it down.

Bart: The- the DSD, dental smile design app does it or preview?

Ashley: Uh, SmileFy does it too. It’s preview has the fastest turnaround and SmileFy is just a little bit longer. Um, we’ve also had our designers mock something up in exocad. Um, it’s not the perfect scenario. They don’t go home with it, but at least they can kind of move it and have that overlay of their face. And we’ve actually had patients that loved it so much that that actually took something outta the way after we did the arch. So that’s always a quick option. If you don’t have those yet, you could have somebody pull something through exocad.

Bart: And guys, just remember as far as the follow-up goes- as far as the follow-up goes, you wanna be short and specific. If- if their objection’s money don’t- don’t- don’t send them before and afters. Don’t write anything that’s not related to it. You know what I mean? You already know what their objection is. So… I mean, it- it works so well, but it has to be short and sweet and it has to be done in a- in a casual tone, right? It needs to- to… It’s gotta be authentic, right? So like you might say, “Hey, um, I had a chance to- to talk with Dr. Such and such, um, about your situation. He asked me to call. He’s got a really good idea that I think you’re gonna want to hear. You got a second?” Don’t say anything else. Just the fact that you went there, the doctor’s giving you more information, you referenced their situation, which you both know is price, you already uncovered that, and you have something. That’s the best way. Because remember with follow-up, we’re not trying to sell, I’m not trying to close. I’m trying to engage and get a response. That’s the most important thing. You can send the longest best sales copy in the world. If they don’t respond to it, it doesn’t matter. You can’t really sell through text messages anyways. I gotta get them on the line, but I have to give them a reason to get on the line with me.

Vicki: Bart, what if you get them on the line and say, for example, a situation that we come across is that because we’re in Miami, we’re at the mouth of Central and South America where aesthetics is much- it’s a third of the price. So one of the biggest concerns we have, because we had a patient that we basically even got them, um, approved for, um, financing and he ended up calling back. His wife convinced him and she was like, “Look, we can go to DR and get it done there for a quarter, you know, price.” So how do you turn that around?

Bart: So are they telling you this over the phone?

Vicki: Yeah, basically he said, you know, he’s like, I’m not gonna pay that one. I can go to Dominican Republic coz his wife was Dominican, so he was like, no. And it didn’t matter if I told him, even if you quoted let’s- let’s go… I- I went to the extra step of telling him, you know, bring it in. Bring the quote that they gave you and we’ll match it. You know, like match… Not match it price-wise but match it, meaning what services are they giving you as opposed to what we’re willing to give you an offer and the quality of course, but how do we bring them back? Because I mean, I can only say, you know, one thing is doing it in the US and another thing is doing it in a third-world country where you don’t have any, you know, protection. I guess that was the best I could do in the moment, but how do I come back from that?

Bart: That’s good. Right? But the-, the question is, how do you get them to originate that thought without you telling them. Make sense? Because like when you’re- if you’re in a follow-up situation or that sounds like… Was that a refund situation?

Vicki: No, no. He just…

Bart: Okay, so you just followed up and they were just telling you?

Staff 1: And even though he was approved for [inaudible]

Vicki: He was approved. He… At first he backed out. I was able to convince him. I was like… Coz he was basing it on his health and on his insurance, his dental insurance. I was like, don’t worry about that. Let’s just see what happens. Let’s get you financed. And he got financed, I think it was for like about 20. And he was super excited, everything. But he was bent on going home and talking to his wife. I was like, okay. You know, there was nothing to hold me- hold him down. When he- when he talked to me, he called me back. He’s like, you know, Vicki, I can’t do it right now because I’m gonna go to DR. I’ll pay a fraction of the price. My wife is Dominican. I can go over there and get it for a fraction. How do I turn that around?

Bart: Okay. So what are the disadvantages of doing that going overseas?

Staff: I mean, I- me personally, I mean I’m Colombian so I know that aesthetics goes a long way in- in South America, right? But the only guarantee that you have in the US is that if your doctor messes up, you can typically go after them. Here it’s more of a- a thing. Whereas in- in third world countries, it’s harder to get legal- legal help or something like that. I mean, I- I don’t know how the systems are over there of returning…

Bart: There’s cheap places in America to get this work done too. If you’re just looking for the cheapest place, there’s cheap places here. You know what I mean? So one of the questions is, is- is price… What’s the most important thing to you when it comes to that? Was it a veneers case you said?

Staff: Full arch.

Bart: It’s full arch implants?

Staff: Yeah.

Bart: Oh, okay. Well, what’s the most important thing? Is it- is it price? Is it just finding the cheapest? Because DR’s not the cheapest. I mean, I can set you up with a place in Nicaragua and you can go and they’ll do that for 50 cents. Nicaragua. I’m just saying. I’m here to help you. It- what’s the mo… Is price… Is the goal here to get it for as cheap as humanly possible? Because I want them to tell me no, that’s not the goal. Because frankly, I don’t care who it is in the DR I can get- I can get it cheap or we’ll go to Indonesia. We’ll find it real cheap. Real cheap. It’s a wooden implant, but who cares? It’s- it is about the- it’s about the lowest price. So you wanna ask what’s the most important thing? Is the price the most important, right? And say, okay, price isn’t the most important. So listen, I’m sure there are really good dentists in the DR I’m sure there are good surges in the DR. It’s not like people don’t get implants. That’s certainly an option, right? So if that’s what you wanna do, then you should go do that, right? All I can tell you is from some of the other situations that come up, there may be some things to think about. Right? Can you think of any drawbacks that you would have going to Dominican Republic to have your surgery done? Can you think of any?

Jody: Recovery. Getting back there on time?

Bart: Yeah, but you want them to say it. See, this is- here’s the deal about like objections, direct objections, especially like ones over the phone, you don’t have a whole lot of time and you can’t come off combative because whatever you say, if you say, well listen, if you go to- if you go to Dominican Republic, well, yeah, it’s less, but like, you don’t- you don’t know what they’re using. They might not have any technology. Are- are they using a digital guided workflow? I mean, are they- are they eyeballing this thing? Like you don’t know what they’re using over there. You don’t- you don’t know what kind of technology. You don’t know what kind of in place, you don’t know any of that stuff. You just know it’s cheap. And if it’s that cheap, you can- it can- you can probably be sure that they’re not using the best technology.

Why do people here… Why do the best doctors use the best technology? Because it’s about the results. It’s not about the price. You ain’t gonna care if you go down there and spend 10 grand, you get a double arch for 10 grand. You come back and you got problems, you’re not gonna care anymore. Right? So I mean… But the more you explain all that stuff, the more kind of combative it gets and the more defensive they get and they start supporting their position, you start supporting your position and you know, you start losing altitude and gaining speed really fast. So what you have to do is you have to ask questions that will get… You have to first say, I understand and that makes logical sense. And I get why you would want to do that. That’s always the first thing. Okay? You never… When someone gives you an objection, never directly try to overcome it. Just don’t, because you’re gonna fall outta raport and you’re gonna put them in a situation where they’re gonna fight harder to defend their position. So the first thing is, I understand why you’re considering this and it makes sense, right? But let me just ask you a question. What question would you ask? Do you see- do you see how you can get into starting to change someone’s mind without directly changing it?

Vicki: Yeah.

Bart: So this is about planting seeds. That’s what it’s about, right? Could you think of any downside? I understand that your wife’s from the DR, I understand that you can go down there, it’s somewhat close, right? It’s a plane ticket. I get all that. Um, and I understand that you’re saying, hey, I can get this for whatever, you know, a third of the price. So I get that. That makes all the sense in the world. Could you think of any disadvantage? So that’s the advantage. The advantage lies in price. Let me ask you, is there any other advantage that you see outside of price to go? Is there any other advantage or is this strictly price? Okay.

Staff 1: [inaudible] price.

Bart: Okay, so if it’s- so if it’s strictly price, can you think of any disadvantages to going. Let me ask you, what happens if you go down there, you have the surgery done, you come back and you have complications? This is surgery, you know? Have considered what your plan B is if you get back to Florida and you have complications? That may be a downside. Some people see it as one, some people don’t. But as long as you have a plan B for that, I’ll feel better. Where do you go with complications and who is actually gonna touch it? Okay? Have you ever considered how they can charge less outside of just the currency exchange? Because the Dominican Republic, this is, uh, you know, this isn’t Honduras, the Dominican Republic, they have super high-end doctors too. Really good doctors. But the super high-end doctors, they’re not the cheapest. Have you ever asked yourself, how is it that they can say they’re doing the same thing but charge a third? Could it be that the materials are different? Could it be that they don’t have a digital workflow? Could it be that they don’t even go through and really do a, a- a- a smile design in the same way? Could it be that they’re not using the same material? Could it be?

Staff 1: [inaudible]

Bart: Right? But again, you have to do it in a way that’s not gonna put you in a position of arguing with them. So you always agree. I understand why you would do that. I see how you see it. And listen, if it’s 100% about price, I get it. That’s a no-brainer. Especially if it’s a third of the price. That’s real money. So I get it. But let me ask you, is the most important thing price, and if it is, that’s a good place to go. And it sounds like you have a… That’s a- that’s an advantage for you, right? But if price is the only advantage that you get by going overseas, what do you think? Would there be any disadvantages to you in terms of aesthetic function, longevity, any- anything you can think of? Can you think of even one disadvantage of you going there that has that- that’s outside of price? See what they say Make sense?

Staff: Yeah. Yes.

Bart: And that goes, it doesn’t matter if it’s over the phone or it’s in person in consultation. That’s a sophisticated way to handle it. Because our goal is to stay in rapport the whole time. I actually- I want to build more rapport. I wanna come off like I’m concerned, but you never want to shoot down their idea. Like it was just- like it’s just a dumb idea or they don’t get it and you never want to take it personal. Right? We’re trying to plant seeds and some of them, you’ll get some of them, you’ll turn them around, and some of them you won’t. But if I can’t turn them around on the phone call, you know how I would end the phone call. How would you want to end the phone call? Because this could very well end up being a failing and alien implant case for you later that you’ll sell, but you wanna end the call on what kind of a note?

Vicki: No, I mean I had a good rapport all the way till he left and everything. And it, you know, I was touching base with him. It seems like he went home, he genuinely spoke to his wife, and all of a sudden his- his whole demeanor with me changed. I mean, we were at your, uh, uh, the event with you guys and obviously we had to close our office to go over there for those two days. But I still picked up the phone from my line right? From, you know, and I would pick up his call and I told him, I said, “Hey, we’re- the office is closed, but…” You know, and he was like, “Listen, you know, I just- I want you to gimme my CT scan.” And that was it. You know? And he was… His demeanor with me completely changed and I couldn’t have been nicer. Like, I was like, don’t worry about it. I mean, I, you know… He- when I first got him, I mean, he was sad ‘coz obviously he-, he had been, you know, he didn’t have his teeth for years. The guy just… He was miserable. You could tell I changed the way he was willing to get financed. He was super happy. But I guess when he went home, she- she must have given him help. Yeah. That’s the only thing I can come up with because…

Bart: Well, she- wasn’t- she wasn’t there, but you know what’s happening, right? That entire decision is predicated off of price. So your goal is just to plant a seed that price isn’t the only factor. And sometimes you make a decision and yeah, I went on price, but is there anywhere else you lose and are we weighing it? I can’t tell them that directly, but I have to- the best way to handle it is to plant those seeds and let them tell you.

Staff: Well, according to a point that you made, um, when we went to Tampa to see you guys, you know, you said, you know, when we’re selling the- the treatment to make sure it’s a yes all the way until they can anymore. And then let’s say they say, you know, hey, that, that price is too high, then we gotta switch. There’s so much going on in that length of time where we need to think fast enough to say, okay, do we go to the doctor? Do we keep this plan because it was working, but do we retract because maybe we needed to give him a lesser, uh, treatment plan and then go back to the doctor? You know what I mean? There was just so many. And obviously, I didn’t know that. I mean, I am- I’m just catching up with everything right now, you know,

Bart: Hey, you’re not gonna get them all. And it doesn’t sound like to me like you did anything wrong. Right? It’s… Here’s where he is, here’s where he wants to be. You guys created a plan that’s going to achieve what he wants to achieve and you present it with a price, that’s what you do. You… Because…

Staff: It’s that switch that’s getting us off, I guess. That switch between when we choose to- to say…

Bart: Why would you switch though? Because it wasn’t that he can’t afford it, it’s that he would rather pay less.

Staff: No, he- he went, you know, unfortunately, you know, in Miami, you know, a lot of people think that the- the dental insurance is gonna cover everything. They think that they’re gonna get a full arch for $2,000, you know, and it’s not gonna happen. You know, and it’s very hard, you know, especially within the Hispanic community to really make that a- a- you know, uh, for them to understand that and to grasp the concept, you know? Right? So what ends up happening is that we end up having to fight so much to- not fight, but like try to persuade them to understand that this is- what they’re getting is- is way more, you know, and giving it value.

Bart: But don’t try to persuade them. Ask them what’s the most important thing. coz they, they- they’re just getting consumed with the price so they can’t see anything else. So just take it away. Right? See, listen, I- I understand it, but… So other than the price, what’s the most important thing here is to you as far as this goes? Is price the number one most important thing? Is it- is it? Is that the- is that the most important? Because I understand it’s important, but is it the most important thing?

Vicki: Right. Okay.

Bart: What else is important? Price aside, what else is important? Ask them. Because you- you have to change their focus without sounding like you’re selling. Because the more you sound like you’re selling, the more you’re pushing and the more they’re gonna dig in. Does that make sense?

Vicki: Yeah. You have to get them thinking, I don’t like to- to correct somebody when I’m- when I’m in a consultation or I’m trying to influence. I don’t wanna correct them. I wanna speak to them in a way where they figure out the correction and they think it was their idea. It’s much better if it’s their idea. Make sense? And that’s just- that’s just takes practice. That’s just where we need to practice the scripts and the loops. Do some improv and- and you know, work on that stuff. Um, you know, in- in the power sessions. Um, that just takes- just takes a little practice. But just remember the overall strategy there, right? If they’re fixated on it, you tell them, I understand why you’re considering it, it makes a lot of sense, I understand where you are, so let me ask you a question. Always handle it the same exact way. You’ll be in more rapport and you’re gonna stay in a fight and chance rather than just coming right back over the top with, you know, the counter position. Cool?

Vicki: Got it.

Ashley: I just have a question back on maybe what we’re doing, um, when we encounter those…

Bart: You’re mute.

Ashley: I’m sorry, the down- the office is calling me downstairs. Um, so when we’re- when we encounter these dental tourism issues, you know, we- we understand them and we get the price and, and we- we take a- a- a place of, I understand exactly where you’re coming from, that price is an issue, but- and we always- we do, I know, but is a terrible word to use, but we do say, I mean, you can go ahead and- and do it there and come out of pocket in full there and save some money. Yeah.

Bart: Done. You’re done. You’re done.

Ashley: Exactly.

Bart: But you’re correcting them.

Ashley: Exactly. So that’s wrong. But we also give them… I know, I’m- I’m gonna just say what we do so that you can give me more feedback on that, is we also tell them, you know, with the financing plans, you’re not taking out or emptying your savings to do it there and you have the security of being close to home. That has saved some cases because we’re giving them that silver lining. Um, and, and it’s definitely created more follow-up calls and kind of wrapped them back in. Um, I don’t know how everybody else’s patients feel, but we also have patients that have done things overseas and they’ll- they’re always willing to jump on the call to talk to these patients. So sometimes when we’re far and we- we have it and then we lose it for a second, we then have our patients reach out. If it’s okay, you know, can one of our patients that kind of did the same thing you’re thinking of doing, give you a call and we have those patients, contact them and let them know the differences and- and what they experience compared to the treatment we provided.

Bart: So there’s no right or wrong. There’s just better and not good, right? So like the- the- the way that’s better is to do everything that you just said, but do it through questions and get them to tell you. I want them to tell me that a downside could be that I don’t have anybody looking at my teeth after I get it done. That the downside could be that I don’t have a maintenance plan. That the downside could be that it doesn’t last. I want… You have to ask questions to get them to say all those things to you without you telling them that’s the key that, or at least that that’s the technique that is by far the most effective in overcoming objections without sounding like you guys are like… You know what I’m talking about, right? When salespeople come in and they’re like, oh, well dah, dah, dah, dah.

It- it works almost- it works almost never compared to the other one. You know what I mean? So exactly what you just said, Ashley. Ask the questions to get them to say that to you. That- that’s the- that’s the, uh, that’s the strategy, you know? Coz then it’s their idea. I’m not selling, I’m just-, I’m just, I’m just shedding a little bit of light. Right? Shedding a little bit of light. I understand you have a price advantage over there. Let me ask you, could there be any disadvantages, price check, that’s an advantage. Could you think of even one disadvantage to going just to look at this thing from all sides? Because if there is a disadvantage, doesn’t mean you don’t do it, but it means you have a plan B and I might be able to help you create a plan B. Can you think of one downside to going outside of needing to get on a plane and go through DSA, you know what I’m saying?

That’s where you guys develop- you have to develop the smoothness to be able to do that and change someone’s mind without correcting them. No, people don’t like to be corrected and they don’t like their belief system to be challenged. And you especially have to be careful if someone is considering going to another country and they’re from the other country coz you don’t wanna insult them, right? So yeah, those are all good things. Those are all good things. Those are advantages to understand where you’re coming from. Could there be any disadvantages? Could you think of even one disadvantage outside of having to go through security and get on an airplane and go there and come back. And then don’t say anything. Just be quiet. You’re like, no, I don’t know. Say, well, have you ever considered… So what were to happen if you went there, got the surgery, came back? Have you ever thought, geez, what’s gonna happen if I have any complications? Do you have a plan B for that? Where would you go? You developed an abscess, you started having a lot of pain. There was puss, like you- you- you had a complication, which happens. Where would you go? What’s a plan B? You’re already here, you need someone like now what would you do?

That’s all. It’s not… It’s much different than me saying, “Hey listen, if you go over there, I can- I can think- without even thinking, I can name five reasons why this is a bad idea. Okay. Number one, they’re gonna do the surgery, send you back, and you don’t have anyone to maintain the teeth. Number two, if they do the surgery and you have a complication, no one’s gonna touch you. Number three, when you go down there and you get the- yeah, you’re gonna pay a third for the price and they’re gonna pay a third for the implants and they’re gonna pay nothing for the digital workflow coz they ain’t got one. They- they probably don’t have a CT, which is why you want the CT scan”. And I mean like, you know, it’s- it’s just not gonna go well. I- it’s- it’s the same thing. It’s just one is just a lot more sophisticated way of doing it where you guys don’t really run a risk of becoming at odds with the patient. Cool. Sorry guys. I know I went way over. I just- I wanted to answer all the questions while we’re here.

Ashley: No, this is great. Absolutely. Great.

Bart: Awesome. Awesome. Okay. Um, you guys go freaking sell some arches. If they say price is the number one thing, say awesome. I have a great place in the jungle in Nicaragua and they’ll do it for free. If you let them do it on you, they won’t charge you anything. So let me… I’ll make the reservation. Sometimes a joke helps like people kind of snap out of it too. It just depends on who you’re talking to.

Ashley: Absolutely. Sorry to interrupt. I just wanted to really, I guess give testimony to what we- we did in the session, you know, last week. Um, I mean, listen, we don’t have a problem closing arches, but we really wanted to just revamp and kind of get our stuff down. We’ve made a lot of changes. Um, not that we haven’t had great days before, but between yesterday- uh, between Saturday and yesterday, we- we closed $260,000 worth of arches

Bart: Awesome.

Ashley: In two days. So just making those changes, um, have definitely gotten our mind to a better place. So, um, we’re really looking forward to coming down in February. I just wanted to get that out there because if you guys work at it, it’s gonna work. So…

Bart: Awesome, awesome. Awesome. Dude, that’s great, Ashley. Well, good job. Thank you so much for that compliment and good job implementing everything. And guys, everybody else, make sure that you guys are doing your videos. Record the video, you’re not embarrassed. Stop it. Record the videos. Send them in, right? Watch the videos with the doctor. Close some arches. Uh, send them to Nicaragua. Okay? Talk next month. All right, Bye-bye guys.

Ashley: Have a great day. Bye, guys.

Bart: All right, see you. Bye.

Maria: Bye.

Bart: Bye-bye.

[END]

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