Fontainebleau Miami Beach, FL
December 1st & 2nd
The Closing Institute’s Full-Arch Growth Conference
Denise: I am thrilled with doing her talk right away. So, he said, “Let us just concentrate on her bottom because she is going to need a lot on her top.” I do not remember looking to see what she was actually approved for, we could probably pull up her finance there.
Bart: No problem. No big deal. I was just curious. She got approved for 25 or 50, or 60, or whatever, but no problem. You guys did a good job on the call. Dr. Brand did really well, too. So, guys, I want to play this video of a consultation. I think there are some things that were done well here that we can learn from, and then I think there is also some things that we can do a little bit better of a job to streamline even more, and l will kind of get into some of that as well.
Bart: Remember, if you guys have any questions, while I am going through this stuff, just type the question into the comment section, and then I can get to it. I can stop and go through it, but I want to kind of get through this. It is a shorter one but it gives you an idea of the first 10 seconds in and the third 10, so they actually got through the whole process in about 40 minutes from open to close, which is pretty good.
Bart: I am just going to hit the highlights, and there is a couple of key points in here that I want us to spend some time on, that I think you guys are going to get a lot of value out of. Then also keep in mind moving forward, we are going to be doing the peer mentoring calls, where I can break you guys up into smaller groups, with Veronica and Sarah. What we are going to do is every time we have one of these calls every month, we are going to take one aspect of the call, and then, we are going to create exercises, and we are going to drill them on the peer mentoring.
Bart: Whether we are drilling, creating urgency, looping, overcoming objections, or whatever it is, I am going to take something from one of the videos, some type of real-life example that you guys are experiencing. Then we will create drills and exercises off that and that is what we are going to be doing on the peer mentorship calls with Sarah and Veronica. So, by the end of the call, I will let you guys know exactly what that is going to be. Let us make sure that you guys have all that stuff on the schedule.
Bart: So these webinars, if you miss one, you can go back and watch it but the [inaudible] is a lot more interactive, where you want to have your camera on and you guys want to be ready to participate because there is not going to be as many people on those calls. It is going to be smaller groups. So, we are going to break you guys up into groups and you work with the same people every time. Okay. I am going to get started– and by the way, this is from Dr. Brand’s practice. This is Denise. Denise, you guys had construction going on? Is that what this is? That is why it was a temporary thing kind of being here because I could hear at first, it was a little loud, I was like, “Why are they not in the consultation room?”
Denise: Yes, it was, yes.
Bart: That was a temporary thing that has been fixed since. So, you will hear a little bit of background noise, but nothing too distracting.
Denise: There is a construction we have going on here. Anyhow, we got to wait for your scan to come through, so why do not you tell me a little bit about what is going on and what your situation is?
Client: I have two sets of dentures, uppers.
Client: One of them is bad.
Denise: That is the story we heard many times.
Client: I have two different partials [inaudible].
Denise: On the lower?
Client: I have nine teeth, two are now very loose and my form over here on the right side is starting to come moist. I am in real bad pain right now. I need them out. I want to implant.
Client: I went to a place in Ohio a couple of years ago and I was not quite to that point yet, so I had to wear a denture.
Denise: Now you know, I had been there.
Client: I am like, “I need the implant”, and then I called the insurance this morning because I did not know you took insurance, and they said with it being down here, it would be out of network but they still cover half. So I said, “Yes.”
Denise: So, yes.
Client: My husband agreed to pay the other half.
Denise: Okay, when they say they cover half, they are only going– they cover up to what? Their yearly maxes?
Bart: Okay, guys, first thing I just want to touch on just as a reminder, when you start these consultations, does everybody have this form? Your patient intake form? If you do not have the patient intake form, I would encourage you guys to get it printed out. You print it out, put your logo at the top, and have the patients fill this out in the lobby before they come in to talk to you because sometimes you can kind of jump right into it and you can miss some things that are really important, or you have to jump into it with a big generic open-ended questions something like, “Okay, so tell me what is going on?” Right?
Bart: I would prefer if we already knew kind of what was going on from the form and instead of saying, “Okay, well tell me what is going on?” You could say something like, “Okay, look, so I understand that you have got a denture that has been giving you trouble. You got a partial that has been giving you trouble and you are kind of looking for the next step, something a little bit more stable, is that right?” “Okay, cool. Tell me a little bit more about that,” and you guys can jump into it with some information, right? If you have no information, it could take you 10 minutes just to figure out why they are there exactly. So, some of the questions we ask here is: What are your main dental concerns? What brings you in today? That is going to give you kind of what their pain points are. You know, like how are these concerns impacting your life on a day-to-day basis? That is going to help with your urgency. That is going to cause them to reflect and help you guys create urgency. What are the most important factors or questions you want clarity on prior to making a decision to move forward? That is going to give you any of their limited beliefs. That is going to give you things to basically kind of tip you guys off on what their objections may be.
Bart: Are you a primary decision maker? That is obvious. Have you seen another doctor? Right? This is going to let you know if it is a second opinion. This does not take long for them to fill out but make sure that you guys are giving this to them, and then take in 2 or 3 minutes in reviewing it before they come back to see you so that you can lead. Does that makes sense? One of the biggest things here, in order to close and stay on task, is your ability to pace and lead. It is very hard to pace and lead if you have no information. If you have no information, I cannot ask specific questions. I have to ask big open-ended generic questions that could go in any type of direction. So, we always want to try to start in order if we can. Anybody that does not have that form, just type it into the comments and I will have Veronica and Sarah send one out.
Client: And tell me when?
Client: Well, I have not need a filling.
Denise: So, we just have to find out what. So your masters are usually in but they said you had implant coverage?
Denise: Okay, well, that is nice. They would at least cover their max, which might be 2000.
Denise: Yes, I do not know what your…
Client: Oh, that sounds wonderful because they did not tell me to get a certain amount.
Denise: Yes. Most insurance companies have a max.
Denise: That is something we can find out for you, but in the meantime, we will just pull up your scan and see what you have. Now, what we want to do here is make sure you are a good candidate for implants. We will check the bone density; the width and the height of it. So, let us get you pulled up here. So, you want to just complete your lower, take out those teeth and put implants on the lower?
Client: Yes, [inaudible] yes. I am going to [inaudible]
Denise: Get it done. So, there is different options. There is a snap-on…
Denise: Nope? You know what you want.
Client: I am on that. I want them.
Denise: You want to…
Client: I know it should happen.
Denise: All right.
Bart: Did you guys hear that? She is like, “So, there is a couple of different options here. There is the snap-on…” and she is like, “No, I do not want that.” So, all of this would probably come out just when we are finding what her urgency is, when we are talking about her pain points, how is this affecting you on a day-to-day basis — that would have probably come out organically, right off the bat. That “Hey, I had a bunch of problems. I have already been on the road of dentures. I already went down the road of partials. I hate it. It is loose. I can be in this way and this way. So I do not want to keep repeating that. I want something that is going to be more stable.” Like that would have come out organically right off the bat.
Denise: Okay, so let us talk about the bridge option. This is an option that goes in the mouth. It is screwed onto both implants. It does not come out. We obviously can take it out when we need to but it is in your mouth.
Bart: So, we are kind of going through this patient education portion. One thing that is good is she stopped her with the snap-on. So, she did not keep going on that and she just went straight to fix. But what we skipped here, is we skipped all of the intel, right? I do not know how it is affecting her life. I do not know what her driving motivation is right now. I do not know what is most important to her. What is she looking for? What is more important? Is she in pain? Is she just getting out of pain? or, is she unhappy with the way that she looks? Is it the way they look that is the most important? Is it being able to eat? What is her driving motivation? I do not know yet and also, why is she here right now? Do you guys remember that question from the scripts? The script does not work if it is super out of order but that question that I really like to ask is like, “Hey, you have been dealing with the– how long have you had the partial? And the denture, you have had this for what?” “Oh, I do not know, 8 or 10 years?” “Wow, that is a long time. So, if you have been dealing with this for 10 years, then let me ask you; Was it something specific that happened that kind of led you to call and come in today? I mean, was there something that happened or something that you felt that you just said, “That is it, I am going to have a change?” Is there something specific, I am interested.” You ask that question, right? That is all intel. What is the intel that I need to be able to close? What do I need? If someone says, “Hey, I want this.” That is fine. Sometimes they will say, “Hey, I want fix. I am going all-in for that is exactly what I want.”
Bart: Sometimes they are a buyer and it is an easy one, and they are going to come in. They have already done the research. They have got tons of urgency, and there is no problem and they buy. Other times, they might say that, but if they do not have a lot of urgency, or they are moderately complacent and then you get all the way to the end and they say, “Okay, well, let me think about it. It is a little bit more than I thought. Let me think about this and get back to you.” You do not have anything to anchor on, right? We do not have any ammunition and we do not have any Intel. I do not know how it has been affecting this person’s life and how they value that. I do not know what they really want out of it. So, when we just kind of skipped through creating the vision, and really targeting and isolating the pain point, then we do not know what their urgency is. It is not a problem, if they have a very high level of urgency, and they have already made up their mind, then that is a buyer. A buyer is a buyer. Where you run into the issue is when the urgency level is not that high, they look at the price and then, they asked to think about it, and we are not able to create the urgency or frame the treatment in a way that is going to be the most valuable or to create the most emotion with this person.
Bart: So, when we miss the emotional side, the process starts to become very transactional in nature, right? When it becomes transactional, and we lose the emotion, emotion is what creates urgency. So, the [inaudible] kind of depend on what they buy, but the emotion is going to depend on when they buy; whether they move forward right now, or they wait or they do it later, or they do not do it at all. It is a really important part of the process to make sure we know what their biggest pain points are, why they are here, what they want to change in the future, how it is affecting their life and help them, kind of empathize with them, and understand where they are coming from. Then help them create a vision for how they are going to feel when they look at themselves, how they are going to feel when they do not have to worry about their teeth, when they are not in pain, create that vision. It does not take long. You do not have to belabor the point there, but without that intel, if it is not a lay down close, you are going to have trouble with it, right?
Bart: You are going to really see the trouble until you get to the very end, and you are going to kind of be stuck, right? Your options are going to be to kind of let them go and think about a follow-up, or you are going to have to circle all the way back to the beginning when you are closing and try to figure it out, and then create urgency because you are going to feel that and they are a little complacent, right? They are not super motivated to do this right now and that is when you will have more of the issues. So, let us make sure before we go into the phase of educating on the actual procedures or answering any specific questions like that, let them talk about their current situation and the story of how they got to this point? That is what I want to know. If they tell me how they got to this point, then I am going to be able to extrapolate a lot of really valuable information, to be able to close this patient on treatment and influence them. If not, we are kind of just hoping that they are a buyer and this thing is a done deal already and sometimes it will be.
Client: It will give up on her knee…
Denise: What did she do? While you are healing because you will be in a temporary, for healing purposes. We like to keep someone in a temporary if we are extracting teeth, [cross talk] not had teeth on your upper.
Bart: So, they got the CT scan, and were waiting for Dr. Brand to get into the room. She was just kind of pulling it up here. We will watch Dr. Brand’s part. But the biggest takeaway with the very beginning, what is the personality type of this patient? This patient has some energy, and she has some certainty, right? She has got some certainty as far as what she wants. She seems extremely open and she actually seems excited about being there, right? She seems excited about being there; which tells me that her urgency level is very high. I just want to know exactly what that is, so that we understand what we are selling because we were trying to not sell a bridge. I do not want to sell implants. I do not want to sell a bridge. I want to sell a vision for something better in the future, or I want to sell the opposite of something that they have or are experiencing right now or have been experiencing for many years. That is what I am selling, right? So, those are the two things I have to be super clear on, but this lady was pretty nice to be able to engage with. Denise had no problems speaking with her because she is really open.
Woman 1: They did already.
Bart: Oh, someone is not muted.
Dr. Brand: It makes it a lot easier. You do not have to beat around the bush. So, here is my thing, I want you to come in. I mean, it was nice to meet each other and then I like to come in and just from the doctor’s perspective, from a scientific perspective, are you a good candidate for what you want to do Okay, so let me summarize that for you on the bottom — great.
Bart: Check this out, guys. So, the first thing we run into, “Hey, I want to make sure that you are a good candidate for what you want.” The problem here is that she is saying she wants fixed, right? But that is not what she wants. What she wants is the outcome that she believes that fixed will give her and that is what I want the doctors to be clear on before the doctor speaks with the patient, right? I want them to be clear on what they want. So, the doctor knows before they come in that, “Hey, this patient has had a lot of dental problems; this patient has been in a partial. This patient has been in a denture. She is not happy with the way the denture looks. She is certainly not happy [crosstalk].” All of that stuff is going on. What she wants is to be able to look better; here is the personality type, and I want them to have a kind of information before they come in. So it is not like, “Hey, I understand that you want the fix on all four.” No, it is, “Hey, I understand you have been dealing with some trouble with the partial and the denture, and it has caused you some heartache here, right? Okay, well, do not worry, we are going to be able to get all that fixed. No problem at all. Yes, you are going to look amazing.”
Bart: Let us go through and talk about this. Then we can kind of get into it but again, that is what we are selling. Do not fall into the trap of selling implants, bridges, fixed or removable; that is just the product but that is not what gets people excited about buying it, right? So, always make sure the doctor is really prepared with that information before they come in and they know what we need to sell, they know what the personality and what the urgency level of the patient is. That is going to help them right off the bat because believe me if you do not, the whole thing is going to get transactional. The more transactional it becomes, the more the consumer mentality you are going to deal with and we do not want that. We do not want them to be thinking in a transactional nature. We want them thinking in an emotional nature. We want them envisioning themselves, so, that the money just pales in comparison to how they are going to feel when this thing is done.
Dr. Brand: So, on the top, I would not say it is great. I would say that it is doable but not great, okay? What I am concerned with is, whereas on the bottom, do you know like how we do the immediate teeth thing? Where we place the implants and put the teeth in? I am confident that you would be a really good candidate for that, and then it would work out nicely. On the top, we are very skimpy on bone, okay? Now, it is not that I cannot create some bone and it is not that I cannot find some bone but I think we have to have a different approach up top, okay? I like to call it the delayed approach; it is where I want to go in and restore your sinuses to like when you were younger. So, what happens is, when we lose our back teeth, the sinuses grow because they are like a big air pocket that is under pressure, and with nothing to stop them, they just keep growing.
Client: I noticed one thing, do you put in my denture that it hurts my sinuses?
Dr. Brand: Well, I think the pressure on them when it is so close to where there is no bone, you probably do feel the pressure because it is such a thin area bone before you actually communicate with your sinus, okay? Now, I am in the business of trying to make people happy but I also am in the business of being realistic and telling the truth. So when it comes to your top, it will definitely be…
Bart: We are going to fast forward through this thing.
Dr. Brand: So, even if we come to this bone this… to get started, okay? You and Denise, I let… travel to do it. So, if somebody told me “Oh, I have got to have this thing loaded like my bottom gets loaded as quick as I can”, I would say, “Well, listen, you got to travel them for a zygomatic arch implant.” Otherwise, we take the steady approach or a predictable approach to doing the sinus lifts and doing it that way, okay?
Client: I need something to do on the teeth down here right away.
Dr. Brand: Well, then let us get started, okay? You and Denise, I will let you guys finish up with everything but the fixed option will be fantastic for you. It will get the bottom teeth back where they belong. If in the meantime, we wanted or needed to make a new top denture to kind of get your smile where we all wanted it, then we can do that while we are working on the sinus lifts and things like that.
Bart: Yes. So, she was saying that one set of dentures look really small and the other set of dentures did not fit really well. She was not happy with the aesthetics of each. But again, she has obviously got a huge level of urgency here to get it done because she just stopped Dr. Brand. She is like, “No, I need to have something for these bottom teeth immediately.” He says, “Okay, well, let us do it this way.” This lady is definitely a buyer.
Client: But like I said, the teeth are so tiny on them.
Dr. Brand: Well, we want to start over. Sometimes, when you are missing tops, the bottoms grow and they grow up more. When I say that, it sounds kind of weird, but they will come up more and dominate the landscape, and what we want to do is we want to bring them back down. We want your front teeth on the top to be the main players. So when I smile, if you are going through the checkout line in Publix and you see the People Magazine… the snapping might be worse because…
Client: We are gonna go with the bottom… my gum from my left because I cannot…
Dr. Brand: You cannot? yes. Well, we got to get you some teeth. We can do that.
Dr. Brand: Let me turn you back over to Denise. Nice to meet you.
Client: It was nice to meet you too.
Dr. Brand: Thanks for coming in.
Client: Thank you for your help.
Dr. Brand: All right, we will see you soon then.
Bart: Dr. Brand does a really good job of just relating to people and just being really down to earth and very personable, which I think, helps create a lot of confidence with the patient. So, he did a great job there.
Denise: I will be right there.
Denise: All right.
Bart: Denise is going to come back with those [crosstalk].
Client: No. Do I have any?
Denise: Do you have any?
Client: Oh, we can go with the bottom, then we will pick the top.
Denise: Okay. All right.
Client: With the sinus…
Denise: The sinus? right. Yes, so what…
Bart: So Denise, I have got a question here; What is the primary treatment plan here? Are we doing the bottom? Full arch fixed on the bottom plus the sinus lift and the denture on top, or what?
Denise: We will just join her lower right now and then when she gets her lower settle, they are going to make her a new denture, but the denture she is still not going to show any teeth on top until they do the sinus work. But she just wants to try a new denture, even though we know it is not going to work.
Bart: Okay, but did we charge her for the new denture on top?
Denise: No, not yet because she wants to do her lower. He has not decided if we are going to charge her for the denture or just make it until we really dive into doing her upper. He is very giving.
Bart: Are you going to do the upper? Are you going to send it out?
Denise: No, if she agrees to do all the sinus work and everything then we are going to do it. If she wants immediate, she will have to do the zygomatic arch, which we will have to send out, yes. So, we will see. She is scheduled tomorrow I believe for her lower surgery.
Bart: Okay. I only asked because it is always easier to make one sale than two or three. So, if she had the credit, in an ideal world if we are like, “Hey, here is what needs to happen for the top and here is what needs to happen for the bottom, this is the treatment plan, here is the dollar amount.” She has the credit to cover it. In ideal world, she just moves forward with the whole treatment plan, and then we just stage it out from there.
Denise: Yes, and I totally get that, but I think we were in a position where he was not 100% sure how she was going to handle her upper. So, I could not quote her for her upper because she was so intent on, “I just want to do my lower right now,” and then he is like, “That is fine. We will concentrate on that and we will come back to your upper.” So that is what I did. I just concentrated on what her main thing was because charging her just for a denture, she is not going to get the results that she wants.
Denise: If we are going to charge for some then that is going to be the same thing she has had before.
Bart: Right, but let us say you sub out to financing. She gets approved for $60,000 and the lower is 22 or 23, whatever it was. It is not a bad idea also to just write the treatment plan up. She does not have to move forward with the rest. So, you will write the whole thing up and say, “Listen, you have gotten approved to cover the whole thing. Dr. Brand needs five days or three days to actually work up the specifics on how we are going to approach the upper and how much that is going to cost a good solid timeline, but the good news is that you are approved for it. So, all we have to do is draw on the credit when we are ready. But as soon as we get the price in the timeline, we can go ahead and get you scheduled and we will just draw on the credit whenever you get scheduled for the sinus lift because we do not want you waiting another six months just to get started on the upper. We understand you want to get this done.”
Bart: But just to put it in her head, try to get it as close as possible so she knows, “I do not want to have to [inaudible] for financing again.” You know what I mean? Because there is a chance that, what if it does not get approved now?
Bart: So, if you got her approved with the credit, try to set the stage, even if they have not worked out because this will happen, guys. Sometimes, if it is a bit more complicated, the doctors will just need a little bit of time to work up the case. But if they are approved for 50, or $60,000, we can tell them, “Hey, we are going to start on this. This is how much it is going to be. There is no problem on all the other stuff. By the time you come back in for your surgery, or for your smile design appointment, or whatever it is, we will have basically a really good detailed idea of what the treatment plan is going to be, how much it is going to cost and what the timeline is going to be. So we can kind of work as parallel as we possibly can to get you both the upper and the lower in a short amount of time as possible. But the good news is, you do have the financing to cover both. So we can draw off of that.” Does that make sense?
Denise: Yes, definitely. I have to go back and check to see how much she was approved for because I cannot remember. Proceed did not do it. So, it went to a lending point, which leads me to believe that was not a big approval amount, but I will check.
Denise: Yes, I definitely see your point, for sure.
Denise: We call it a delayed approach, which I am sure he talked to you about. So we would not do the sinus part but in the meantime, we can start with your lower. When we do in the lower, what we are going to do is we are going to bring you in. They are going to scan the inside of your mouth, all right? That is when we want you to bring your upper, okay? Bring both of them.
Denise: Then we need to scan them…
Bart: Denise, one more thing I will say about this is let us make sure that before Dr. Brand leaves the room, there is a very clear primary treatment plan or a recommendation, right? Because what he said was that, “We are going to do the sinus lift and the denture. Get you in the denture so that it looks better and we are going to do the lower.” That is actually what he said right before he got up. She did not really get that or understand it, and then she said, “Hey, we are going to do the lower,” and now we are like treatment planning the lower, so let us just make sure a hundred percent that we are very clear on, “Okay, so are you recommending that we only do the lower?” or, “Are we doing the lower plus the denture and the sinus lift for the upper, and we are just going to work out the implants later. What exactly is this treatment plan?” Just to be super clear on what that is because he kind of said something different than you did right here.
Denise: Okay, yes.
Bart: I think. I am going to rewind it just to make sure I did not hear that wrong.
Client: I got the second set done because the entrance was not paid for another Doctor right away and so they fit for a couple of weeks.
Dr. Brand: Right, and then no more?
Client: No more.
Dr. Brand: Okay. Well, some people just need something that stays in by band screwed-in. They got the security. If they can get the security with the looks, not to mention how much better you can easily…
Client: So is it nothing more than one because there is not enough?
Dr. Brand: Yes, it is not that it might be worse because of the ability… the stability with eating and some… We got to get you some teeth. We can do that.
Dr. Brand: Let me turn you back over to Denise, nice to meet you… provide a level of support with each implant helping the other implant.
Dr. Brand: So it is not a bad idea to have the screwed-in for your particular situation, and that is certainly the way I would go if you can swing it because you are going to get the best of all worlds with security, with stability and with eating.
Client: I only eat some fruit and vegetables… my gum from my left because I cannot.
Dr. Brand: You cannot? yes. We got to get you some teeth. We can do that.
Dr. Brand: So let me turn you back over to Denise. Nice to meet you.
Client: Nice to meet you too.
Dr. Brand: Thanks for coming in.
Client: Thank you for your help.
Dr. Brand: All right, we will see you soon then.
Bart: He must have said it right before that.
Denise: …come out, then implants go in.
Client: Awesome, [inaudible] my mouth work so bad.
Denise: I have two doctors here. We have Dr. Brand who you just met. Dr. Resta Meyer, who you have probably seen him running around, not the electrician.
Bart: Can I get to the place where… [crosstalk].
Denise: We have got to start off with a temporary, your temporary is… finance it and then when we actually… your warranty if anything goes bad, we are going to stand behind it… we may make you another one in between, depending on how much healing you do. If it gets really bad and you are really getting stuff, sometimes they like to make another temporary in between there.
Denise: So, you probably want to know about the price now. I am just talking about the lower. We do have our own lab here, and because we have our own lab here, this fee is not what it is. These fees that you have, luckily, we are able to take down a lot because we are not sending stuff out to a lab and I do not even have a pen anywhere here, do I?
Client: I have a pen. Oh, you got one?
Bart: Guys, she is using her implant bundle form right here and showing it to herself. The one with the higher retail fee on it? That is what she is showing right now.
Denise: For a single arch with your zirconia, it includes everything; the extractions and the implants. We have a 5-year warranty. If anything goes bad, we are going to stand behind it. We are going to take care of any issues at all, okay? So that is all included, there is that. For double arch, it is $44,000.
Denise: Yours would be a single, so if we are starting for just the lower, it is $22,000.
Denise: It includes everything that you see here, but again, we do not have to charge you that much because we can take it down until this month.
Bart: Denise, you can sell this a little bit more because we do not want to show it to her immediately, like take it all away. What we are trying to do with the retail fee is explain that there is a lot of work that is going to go into this and you guys are not going to cut any corners. You are not going to cut any corners. It is not going to be a bait and switch where you are going to pay for this, and the next time you got to pay for that. It is like, this is what it is. We do not cut any corners and you are going to be done. There is no more out-of-pocket expense after this. Right? So, in order to do this and get really good results, this is everything that is going to be involved.
Bart: Now, the average fee for something like this, Dr. Meyer is going to be anywhere from $28,000 to $35,000 if all this stuff is included, which is right around where we are. But because we have a lab, we are able to actually save on expenses because we are not sending that out. There is a lot of things that would normally be expenses to other practices that actually are not to us and we go ahead and pass those savings on to you. So, even though the value in how much this case normally cost is this, whatever is on that paper, is $35,000 per arch, when we show you what we can actually get this number down to because we have an in-house lab and because we do so many of these types of cases, right?
Bart: So, for this, you do not have to pay for, you start crossing it off. So basically, $35,000 turns into more like $22,000 for your lower arch, which means we are doing everything involved and we are still below the average of what people charge for, just the [inaudible] for. Most of them do not offer warranties, sedation, and all the things that we are offering you. So, it actually turns into a pretty significant discount for you. Does that make sense? We want to sell it and I know it is kind of nerve-wracking. You do not want to show them the pricing and think it is [inaudible] shock, but it is part of the psychology. I want to justify the price and also put some doubt in her head that, “Oh, well, maybe those lower fees are not actually including everything. I never thought about that. So they show me a low fee, but then next visit it is going to be actually more.” Those are the seeds I am planting by showing retail versus wholesale. So, you want to present it with some strength. If you present retail and we immediately tell them like, “All right, here is what it is, but this fee is not real. This is not a real fee, do not worry.” We kind of lose a little bit of it. So present it and then explain that it includes everything. They are not going to be charged more on their next visit. This takes care of them for a full year or 5 years, or whatever it is. There is no corners are cut, and also, the average fee for something like this is going to be anywhere, for zirconia, is going to be $27,000 to $35,000, that is the average. So, we are actually wined up $5,000 below the average and we include more. So, it turns into a very substantial saving, in terms of cost-savings for you, which is a good thing. Does that make sense? That is something that we are going to be working on as well; just presenting the close and selling that with confidence.
Client: I want to find out how much are we talking?
Denise: We do have financing options so you can finance it. Then, when we actually do this procedure, we send it into your insurance, and whatever they pay goes directly to you. You can take that amount that they pay and you can pay it towards your financing.
Client: Oh, okay.
Denise: Yes, and there is no…
Bart: The other thing is that we want to try not to run the financing before we are given a reason, right? So, the close is always the same. We go through retail versus wholesale, it ends up being really good cost-savings. So, your price is basically $22,000 all-in, and that includes the 5-year warranty and that is it. Then she goes, “Okay.” Then, we will find out how much the insurance is going to pay. It is like, “We are going to max out whatever your insurance will pay. Who is your insurance? Oh, it is Delta? Okay, we work with those guys all the time. Whatever they pay, we will try to get the maximum amount, and then they are just going to reimburse you. So, they are just going to cut the check straight to you. It might be $2000, $3000, or $3500. Whatever the max is, that is what we are going to work to get for you, but that check will go straight from them to you. Just to reimburse you directly. Does that make sense?”, “Cool. Okay, great!”, “So, how would you like to pay for that?”. We always have to ask them how they want to pay for it first.
Bart: Given the opportunity, they give you a credit card or write a check or say, “I have been saving for it so I have the money. I can write you a check or give you a credit card or I can wire the money, or whatever it is”. But go ahead and close and just ask them, “How would you like to pay for that?” If there is a problem with paying for it in full right now, which is basically what we are expecting. It is an assumptive style close. I do not want to create an objection. I do not want to create a need for financing if there is no need for financing. Does that make sense? You guys have to pay financing fees, they pay interest, we kind of ran the risk and if they decline, now, what? If we present it like, “Well, the first thing we do is to get you the finance”. Even if they have the money they are going to feel that, they should just try for the financing. So, go ahead and just close on the $22,000. If there is a financial objection, we can fall back to financing, or we can fall back to scaling in a different way to kind of reduce the principal. But always close on the full dollar amount. Assume that they are going to write you a check or give you a credit card. Most times, they will not, but they never will do that if we do not give them the opportunity to do it, right? That is obviously ideal.
Denise: Prepayment penalty with the financing…
Client: Oh, good. Okay.
Denise: It all takes care of itself. Would you like to look into the financing that…
Client: Yes. The thing is my husband will be the one. I do not have any income. He would be the one who would have to get the financing. So, I do not know–
Client: Like I said, he is in Ohio so I do not know how we can…
Denise: All I really need from him is his Social Security Number.
Client: I wrote that down.
Denise: And the amount of money that he makes.
Client: He makes 26,000 CND a year, and depends on– because he gives social security…
Bart: Guys, we just got a question from Rachelle. She said, “What if we know going into the appointment that they need financing?” If you know that they need financing going into the appointment, then I am assuming that we already have them approved. So, if they are telling you, “I need financing” then I am getting them approved before I see them. Right? Because if the whole thing is contingent on financing, why I am going to bring them in if they are declined? If they tell you that over the phone, collect the information and go ahead and get the approval so that you know that this person is qualified to actually make a purchase. Does that make sense? Because they are giving you a financial objection right off the bat, saying look, “I want to do it. I need it. I am down to do it, but I have got to get a loan for this. I do not have the money”. So there is no reason doing a consultation if they are declined. If that happens and they are upfront about needing financing, then we are in the triage mode. We are, “Okay, well, let us go ahead and see what you get approved for”. Then, I just take Social Security, get their information, run on them and make sure that they are approved.
Bart: This person never gave us a financial objection. She never said a word about, “Well, how much is it going to cost? Is it this? Is it that?” The closest she came was that she did not know what percentage insurance would cover. That is the closest she came to a financial objection, which is kind of a little signal that they are maybe an issue, but it is not as blatant as someone saying, “Look, I do not have the money for this. I have to get financing.” or someone saying, “Look, how much is this? Before we go any further just so I am not wasting your time, I do not have whole a lot all of money”. Those are very clear triage cases. She is not acting like money is an issue. She is not. I mean, this whole time they have been talking about it, she never asked once how much it costs. She is not acting like it is a huge issue for her.
Client: …and then his income.
Denise: Would you say he has a pretty decent credit score?
Client: We just bought a house, so it went down a little bit.
Denise: It does. I know.
Client: Bu it was a 7 number.
Denise: Okay. Well, if you want, it is a soft hit. If you have all this information we can pull it up. We can see what he is approved for.
Client: He said, “Do it”.
Denise: Okay, and then, I will just have…
Bart: Okay, quick example of assumptive close. When we say, “Okay, well if you want, we can do this or that”, it is never if you want, it is all “Okay, so let us do this, do you have the Social Security handy? If you have the information, I will just write it now and get you going. Sound good? Cool, let us do it.” There is no like, “Do you want to do this” or any of that. So, everything is just assuming, like we are going into it assuming that she has the information to do the credit check. We want to assume that she is moving forward, assume all of these different things. Try not to ask for permission. It is much better to just kind of assume that it is going to happen. Let them tell you “no.”
Denise: And then, we go from there, it gives you different payment options.
Bart: Fast-forward to this part.
Denise: Okay… it could be credit for, debt to income. So, the interest rate is pretty high, and then that would be the payment for 6 years, 60 months.
Client: We can go for 6 years or 60 months.
Denise: I am sorry. Yes. 5 years.
Denise: That would be the payment.
Denise: There is no prepayment penalty. If ever you get a chunk of money, whatever…
Bart: I would probably refrain from saying the interest rate is pretty high. I would kind of let them put that together. If it is me, I am going to say “Hey, Congratulations! We got you approved. Everything is good, right? Here is your monthly payment, we can spread it out over 60 months to make it easy and that is it, you are done, we can get you scheduled”. Forget all that stuff. Maybe she thinks it is high, maybe she does, if she thinks it is super high she is going to say something. If not, I am not going to plant that though, right? We do not want to create an objection that does not exist. Make sense? Because it is better high-interest rate than no loan. This lady sounds desperate to get this done. She has got a very high level of urgency here. So, I would just kind of [inaudible] over that, “Here is the interest rate but look here is the most important thing, we are going to spread it out over 60 months, and here is what is your payment going to be. We can get this thing scheduled in the next 2 weeks, get you started, get this thing done, then finish it up”.
Denise: Put it towards it to cut that interest down.
Denise: So, I am sure you need to talk to him before?
Client: No, I do not.
Denise: Oh, all right.
Client: I talked to him last night. I said “I am going”, and he said, “Do what you needed to do”.
Denise: Is that a payment that you are comfortable with?
Denise: You are good with that?
Bart: Okay. So, hold on.
Denise: You want to do it?
Denise: All right.
Client: I want to get it done.
Bart: So, a couple of things right there to unpack.
Client: No, I do not.
Denise: Oh all right, so you want… yes, 5 years.
Denise: And that would be the payment.
Denise: There is no prepayment penalty. So, if ever you get a chunk of money, whatever, I would put it towards it to cut that interest down.
Bart: So Denise, you got to get your fangs out here, right? You got somebody with urgency and you got it on approval. I do not know how much it was for but clearly, it was over $22,000, right? You got an approval and you got urgency. This is a wounded gazelle.
Denise: I have to defend myself a little bit.
Bart: We got to get her.
Denise: Because it was not in her name, it was in her husband’s name and I did not have him there.
Denise: I was told when we are doing financing that you have to give them 48 hours or something to change their minds. I wanted to make sure she was a hundred percent sure that he was cool with it before I did anything. I did not have him sit in there, so I had to reconfirm, “Do you need to talk to him?” I wanted her to tell that, “No, I am good, I can go” so I was a little bit, “Okay, he is not here. I do not have him telling me it is okay…”
Bart: He is going to have signed the docs though.
Bart: So, there is no way that she can just do it unless she literally forged his signature which obviously is not going to happen. So, no matter what, the docs have to go to him. He has to sign the docs for that loan to go through. The docs are going to go to him. It is all kind of how you ask. Everything you just said, we can do it in an assumptive way. What I would be careful about is placing doubt. I can say there are couple of different ways. If you say something like, “Hey, are you sure that it is okay with your husband?” You can say it in that way, where it is like “Hey, I am saying basically this might not be okay, this is his credit, you should probably check with him first” or, you say can it in a way like, “Okay, well, I mean, you have already spoken with your husband, you guys are on the same page about this. So what I can do is, go ahead and get you scheduled, start moving the process forward, they are going to send the documents straight to your husband. It is important that he reads the documents and signs the document since the loan is under his name. You can kind of review the details with him. But as far as we are concern, I will start the process and get everything rolling for you. Does that make sense? Does that sound fair?” You know what I mean?
Bart: I am saying the same thing which is basically like we want to make sure that he knows everything that is going on and that he is signing the documents. But what I am doing is I am assuming that they are on the same page and she has his permission. I am acting like, “Of course, he approves and of course, he wants this for you.” I am going to make her stop and tell me, “Well, I am not sure he is going to be okay with this” Does that make sense?
Denise: Yes. Okay.
Bart: That is what I mean when we got the approval and we got the urgency. We do not want to create a problem. I want to let her bring the problem to me. I am assuming that there is no problem. Zero.
Denise: So, I am sure you need to talk to him before?
Client: No, I do not .
Denise: Oh, all right.
Client: I talked to him last night. I said, “I am going”. He said, “Do what you needed to do”.
Denise: And is that a payment that you are comfortable with?
Denise: You are good with that?
Denise: You want to do it?
Denise: All right.
Client: I want to get it done.
Bart: “Is that the payment you are comfortable with? Do you want to do it?” Again, it could get someone thinking like, “I do not know, can I get a lower payment?” You got them thinking about the payment, right? I am telling them the payment is great because you can spread it out over 60 months. A lot of the different financings will be only for twelve months, maybe 24, and you are actually approved for 60, so it is a lot lower than it would normally be with other financing companies. So this is great. “The payment is good, the payment is low, we can get you scheduled and everything is ready to go. So, I will get you started with everything. Cool? Sound good? Let us do it.”
Bart: I am just assuming the whole thing straight through. So, you want to be as strong as possible there. I do not want to plant any seed that could turn into doubt that did not previously exist. As a matter of fact, I want to do the exact opposite which is, I want to project my confidence and my explanation of basically, “Hey, you are doing the right thing. Everything is totally normal. There is nothing to worry about here, it is all good” right? Right along the way. They will fall right along the way. Denise, you did everything good when you got her close. It is just the tonality thing. Had you been dealing with somebody who did not have as high of a sense of urgency. It is very easy when you ask someone, “Hey, is this payment okay?” for them to go, “That is a good question. I should probably talk to my husband about that because we just did buy a house, so we are a little tight. I just need to make sure that payment is something we can do. Let me talk to him and get back to you”. That could completely happen. That is a very realistic situation that you want to try not to open the door. I do not want to open the door for any of that. Especially, because she just told me that they just bought a house. So I am already thinking like, “Oh, man. Am I going to be able to get this person approved? They just bought a house so they are going to be tight around finances or they could be tight around finances.” I am making a big deal out of the 60-month thing. I am making a big deal that the payments are low and that this is easy, and I can get her going right now and there is nothing in our way. There is no delays, nothing at all.”
Bart: Does that make sense? All right, cool. Is everyone muted? Hey guys, I am going to unmute your real quick, so we can have a 5 minutes real quick of some questions and answers. Just to let you know, we are going to be practicing on the peer mentoring in assuming the sale because these things happen even when we are in the class or we are at a course, like a boot camp or something. A lot of times we go through and we are doing closes and we are doing improv. We will be like, “Okay, so do you want to do it?” or “Okay, is this payment okay? Is this price okay?” We are asking for permission instead of assuming the sale. So, we are going to be practicing that; assuming the sale and just how to deliver that, and kind of stay away from opening doors that could complicate or slow the sale down.
Bart: So, did you guys have any specific questions? I think we learn a lot in the first ten. It was a really good information. We learned a lot in the middle part and in the close. Thank you for using the form and using the bundle. That was good. She liked the discount on it. A lot of good things happened and you got her close. At the end of the day, that is the bottom line is you close her over $22,000 right here, pretty much on the spot which was great. Did you guys have any specific questions you want to ask or review?
Woman 2: I do.
Woman 2: How are you?
Bart: I am good. What is up?
Woman 2: Great. I was late getting on because I was with a patient. That patient intake form, when do you all want us to do that?
Bart: When the patient is in the lobby. They fill out the new patient paperwork.
Woman 2: Right.
Bart: As soon as they turned that in, hand them the new patient intake form. Do not give it to them with the new patient paperwork because they are just filling it out as fast as they can. I want to give that to them separately. So, take the new patient intake paperwork, and then give them the patient intake form. They will fill that out, turn it in. Give it to the treatment coordinator. She can review that for 3 minutes when they come in, and that we will help understand what the pain point is, what they are there for, what their urgency level is, stuff like that.
Woman 2: Got it. Okay. Thank you.
Bart: No problem.
Bart: What can I do for you, Bart? Yes, sir?
Bart: I am right here. Our doctor, Maximo, when we start– First, we get the symptoms, what they are going through, any kind of research they have done, here they are at this point, whether they are in any kind of prosthetic or had any opinions they were getting. If it is important to them, some people it is not, it is like their vision or their smile. When we are going through the models, he wants us to say the price. Not just saying things like, “This is the more premium model” and then I have said that if they still did not ask anything yet as far as, “Well, how much could this possibly be?” If they are not trying to give ballpark signals, then the next thing I say in the script is that, “We will see the 3D models. We will see the options that are possible.” and that they would talk to me about the obvious things and I say, “Price of the option that you pick and all the logistics”, and then if they are is still not saying anything then the script says just let them go on. But Dr. Maximo wants us to say what it takes like when we start showing just the bait, like the overdenture or the hybrid, and to say that, “This is what it is.” if they are not giving buying signals. What is your thought about that?
Bart: Well, the buying signals that they are there in your office. I mean, that is like, why are they are there? So everybody is a buyer, it is just the question is, “Are they qualified to buy?” Right? That is the main thing we are to trying to figure out. That is probably what Dr. Maximo is looking at. It is like, “Hey, we are getting patients through and then they cannot get finance, they do not have any money,” and we are trying to save time there which I totally get. But I would not put any of that ahead of the importance of finding out what we are trying to sell and what is their main concern, why they are here, and what is their urgency level? Right? What is their urgency level? What is it that we are really selling? You cannot sell the implants, you can, but you are going to constantly be in a price war doing that. Price is going to be very transactional and you are going to lose all the urgency in the motion. [crosstalk] It is like somebody coming on to car lot and let us see if they are selling [crosstalk] you have got your choice of Mercedes, Toyota, Prius, you got a Honda, and you got a Rolls Royce, and you can sell any of these things. Right? They are all at different price points. What you are going to do when someone walks on the lot, are you going to tell them, “Now look, these cars start at this much…” [crosstalk]
Bart; “Hey, what type of car are you looking for? What is most important for you? Is it comfort? Is it technology? Is it performance? Give me an idea of the type of experience you want to have when driving the car, so that I know and kind of match you up with the car that best suits what you are looking for”. Which one is more important? To give them what they want or to give them the prices? Even if they buy something, if it is not what they want, it can never be an achievement. [crosstalk] So we always have to start there. If the price is a huge issue, usually they are going to tip you off. This patient never said anything in this example. So, to me, I would not be hitting her with all kinds of prices since she [inaudible] [cross talk].
Bart: Had the first thing gone a little bit different? It might got a little bit more information but with somebody like this, she is obviously in a very high sense of urgency. I think that you just need to be careful with raveling of prices before you are asked and before there has been a recommendation. You just have to be careful. It can come off the wrong way. It can come off presumptuous, depending on how it is done. If I am in some mall and they are like, “Sir, you understand even the base model for this type of a car is $90,000” and I am like, “So you think I do not have 90,000?”, “Okay, so what? We have not even decided what car I want yet, why are you throwing fees in me?”
Bart: Yes, because there has been some where, it is like they already had traditional prosthetics and they just really did not like the feel of them. They were tired of them being loose and everything like that. Then, when you show them the models and they really like the idea of the hybrid essentially, that they did not have to take it out, those kind of things. Then, later on we find out that $200 is like all they could really do per month because of their financial situation. It is like you can always find that out until after the fact. I mean, they never seem to be upset, they just had no indication of what it is going to take, but I see the point.
Bart: If you go through the process, if you guys do not skip steps and if you really go through it, it is going to be so hard for somebody to sit there, you found out their primary desired outcome, you know what their urgency level is, you got them, right? You are here, then you go into the patient education, you go through denture, removable, and fixed. If they get through all of those explanations and they never asked anything about, “Well, give me an idea of what is the difference in price between this versus that?” Right? Or, they do not come out and actually tell you that they have already had a treatment plan created. A lot of times they already know what the ballpark pricing is. You might find out that just with the new patient intake form.
Bart: So, it is tough for someone to get all the way through that, not mention anything about, they have already had a treatment plan done, not mention their level of awareness in terms of price, and not ask any question when prices are real issue. It is tough, but if we are not patient in leading, what can happen super easy is the patient starts pacing and leading, and what they do is they skip you from intro to close, immediately, and we basically just skip everything and they are kind of pacing and leading us. Then, we kind of get to the end.
Bart: It is just important for us to pace and lead, and make sure that we are asking questions that are kind of leading them down the right path. I would be careful about making generalizations and saying, “Hey, every time we go through patient education, I am going to give them the pricing.” Because the doctor has not seen them and we have not made a recommendation yet, we have not done a CT yet, there has been no diagnostics, the only time I am given the price is if they queue me in to tell me that they need to be triaged.
Woman 2: Yes.
Bart: Yes, because we have had some that have queued in and then we are able to narrow down really what they wanted; the range that they would be comfortable talking about, and then if they [inaudible] on some of them. I mean, we have not been doing it long, but there are 2 where I show them the selection and they select $150 to $200 a month. But base on the things that we end up talking about, they really want to talk about this hybrid model and granted that they could just pick that, they could have the cash for it or they could get– I know they get financed for $50,000, I mean the lowest payment that they are going to get with Proceed is like $900 a month for 8 years. It is like if you are selecting now, “Are we wasting time talking about things that are really just out of your range? or, “Sir, I have a question. Like, what kind of research have you done up to this point? Have you read the email that was sent to you?”
Bart: A lot of those people are saying, “No” to both.
Bart: Which is okay, just kind of go through the normal process and they are like, “Man, I have to make sure that I can afford this, like how much is it all?” Then, go straight into the triage script. Triage them aggressively. Just do not triage somebody where price is not their biggest thing. Their biggest thing might be, “Hey, I have been to 3 different doctors and they all told me that I am not a candidate for implants. I do not give a damn what it costs. I am ready.” But for instance, I do not know, this could have been one of her main concerns, “Is that why the other doctors would not even do the case because of the lack of bone? I just do not know, but I would not want to take somebody like that if money is not the issue and all of a sudden, I am the one making money the issue now.”
Bart: Okay, thank you. I appreciate it.
Bart: A couple will slit through, but do not worry about it. Anybody else have anything specific that you want to ask in regards to questions on the first to second and to the third 10 here?
Woman 3: Good.
Bart: You are good? Okay, cool. If you are not using the patient intake form, please use it. It is silly not to use it. You are going to get that information ahead of time and you are going to know so much and because it is a form that has to be filled out, it dictates that the patient be succinct, [crosstalk]. Because they are not just going to write forever, so they are going to kind of get to the point on the form. Then you guys, as soon as you sit down, you are in the process, you have a background data, and you can just roll. Do not move forward into patient education phase before you know what is their level of urgency. If they have a moderate or a low level of urgency, what do you have to do? You have to raise it. That urgency levels got to come up, so we have to figure out some way to disturb their complacency and to get them more motivated. We are doing nothing, it is just not an option that makes sense for them. So, we either do that with pain or we do that by creating a really compelling vision of pleasure for the future, either one. But one of those things has to happen if you are lacking urgency or you get the feeling that that particular person is a little bit complacent.
Bart: Then as far as the close, close on the retail fee. Give them that retail fee, like “This is what you are going to pay,” and explain to them what it is and explain to them that it is all-inclusive. It is not like you are going to come in and pay one thing and then every visit, you are going to be hit for other fees. Explain to them that you stand behind your work, and kind of explain the story of how you are going to extend some cost-saving onto them. Always assume the sale. That is what we are going to be working on the next calls. You guys are already scheduled for those. Please try to make sure that you are on them because that is where we can be a little more interactive in terms of the exercises where we are practicing more like the boot camp. So, that should help a lot. Again make sure that you guys are recording your consultations. Denise, great job on getting this particular patient closed $22,000. Got them! Anything you need, let us know. Make sure you guys are recording consultations and sending them over. Then, we will see you guys on the monthly call. Cool?
Woman 2: Yes, sir!
Bart: All right, girls.
Woman 2: Thank you Bart. Bye.
Bart: Thanks. Talk to you later. Bye.
Woman 3: Bye.
Denise: How long is this? 1 of 10 videos, did you say?
Bart: I do not know.